Director of Public Prosecutions v McKay

[2016] VCC 1512

IN THE COUNTY COURT OF VICTORIA Revised
(Not) Restricted
Suitable for Publication

AT BAIRNSDALE
CRIMINAL JURISDICTION

CR-16-01081
CR-16-01085

DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC PROSECUTIONS

v

JAKE MCKAY
TOBY BLACKBURN

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JUDGE:	HIS HONOUR JUDGE STUART
WHERE HELD:	Bairnsdale
DATE OF HEARING:
DATE OF SENTENCE:	7 October 2016
CASE MAY BE CITED AS:	DPP v McKay
MEDIUM NEUTRAL CITATION:	[2016] VCC 1512

REASONS FOR SENTENCE
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Subject:
Catchwords:
Legislation Cited:
Cases Cited:
Sentence:

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APPEARANCES:	Counsel	Solicitors
For the Director of Public Prosecutions	Mr D. O'Doherty
For Accused McKay	Mr J. Anderson
For Accused Blackburn	Mr R. de Kretser

Pages 1 - 18

 

 

HIS HONOUR: 

1Jake McKay and Toby Blackburn, you may remain seated.  You have each pleaded guilty to one charge of armed robbery, which carries with it a maximum penalty of 25 years' imprisonment.

2The circumstances surround that armed robbery are set out in the summary of prosecution opening, which became Exhibit 1 on the plea.  I rely heavily on that summary for my purposes.

3The two of you, on Thursday 9 December 2015, went to an address at
14 Charles Street in Bairnsdale.  It was there that the armed robbery occurred.  You, Jake McKay, were 21 years of age at the time and are now 22 years of age.  You, Toby Blackburn, were 21 years of age and are now 22 also. You knew each other, and you, Toby Blackburn, had been in a relationship with McKay's younger sister, Bethany McKay. 

4At about 10 pm on the day in question, you both knocked on the front door of that address.  Brad Anderssen opened the door, and the two of you demanded to know where Mr Saunders was.  Mr Anderssen informed the two of you that Mr Saunders was not at home, and may be with a female named Megan Nall.  You entered the residence and demanded something of value belonging to Mr Saunders. 

5Mr Anderssen was afraid, and provided the two of you with a PlayStation 4 and two PlayStation games in a ‘Jack Daniels’ branded backpack.  These items all belonged to Mr Saunders.  You took them, and left the address, thus the charge of armed robbery.

6When you, Jake McKay, were interviewed by police, you made full admissions to attending at the address and that you were looking for Mr Saunders.  During the course of that interview you indicated that you were in Mr Blackburn's Toyota Hilux with Mr Blackburn and Bethany McKay.  They left the vehicle and eventually the two of you armed yourselves with a copper bar and a tyre wrench before walking to Mr Saunders' home. 

7You wanted to speak with Mr Saunders about him spreading rumours that he had stolen a trailer.  You had armed yourself in case there were other males at that address, finding an unknown male, Mr Saunders.  You further admitted that having gained access, you demanded something belonging to
Mr Saunders, and were given the PlayStation in the backpack. 

8You, Mr Blackburn, were also interviewed and made admissions to attending the address, but stated that you did so on your own.  You admitted going to the address, where you demanded items of value from a male, that you were in possession of a tyre iron, and that the male gave you a bag with the PlayStation inside.  You denied suggestions that Mr McKay had been involved.

9Each of you pleaded guilty at the earliest opportunity. 

10In addition, Jake McKay, you have pleaded guilty to a summary offence of failing to answer bail without reasonable cause.  That matter carries with it a maximum penalty of two years imprisonment.  Furthermore, at the time of this offending, you were the subject of a suspended sentence order of four months, suspended for a period of 12 months in the Sale Magistrates’ Court on
4 August 2015.   You committed this offending four months later, thereby breaching that wholly suspended sentence. 

11Turning to you, Toby Blackburn.  You have also pleaded guilty to a number of other summary matters, including breaching a community corrections order, which carries with it a maximum penalty of three months’ imprisonment.  That community corrections order was imposed at the Bairnsdale Magistrates’ Court on 30 September 2015.  A little over two months later, you committed this armed robbery, thus both of you were the subject of court orders.  In your case
Mr McKay, a suspended sentence; in your case, Mr Blackburn, a community corrections order, when you committed this most serious offence.

12You too, Mr Blackburn, have consented to having that matter dealt with by me.  The original offending for which you are being dealt with involved a charge of criminal damage and unlawful assault. 

13The circumstances surround that offending are that on 28 July 2015, you engaged in a verbal dispute with your mother which escalated to the point where you were throwing household items around, punching holes in the plaster wall and yelling abuse at your mother.  You then threw a cane bookshelf at her, striking her to the right side of her face causing her minor pain at the time. 

14Having been placed on that community corrections order you breached it by failing to attend appointments on no less than 20 occasions. In the conclusions and recommendations of the breaching report, the authors write:

"Mr Blackburn has not successfully completed any treatment conditions as directed while subject to the community corrections order."

15In addition, you have pleaded guilty on a further indictment to one charge of criminal damage, and two related summary charges of breaching intervention orders.  Those charges carry with them respectively a maximum penalty of ten years imprisonment and two years’ imprisonment.

16The circumstances surround that offending are that on 19 November last year a family violence intervention order had been granted.  Despite that order, which contained conditions prohibiting you from committing family violence, damaging property or being within five metres of your mother, or twenty metres of her address if under the influence of illicit drugs, you, at 3.30 in the afternoon of Wednesday 9 March, some five months after the intervention order was put in force, attended at her address in an agitated state after an argument with your partner.

17You kicked in the back door, causing damage to it.  You then punched a hole in the wall in the hallway of her home.  Thus the charge on indictment of criminal damage, and the summary charge of contravening the family violence intervention order.

18Two days later, on Friday 11 March 2016, you again attended at the victim's house.  You apparently had become upset with the way she had parked her vehicle in her own driveway, the premises that you could not attend pursuant to the intervention order that was then in place.

19Undeterred, you yelled at her and caused her to fear for her safety, thus, summary charge 2, of contravening a family violence intervention order.

20Each of you have prior criminal histories.  Turning first to you, Jake McKay.  Leaving aside what I consider to be irrelevant Children's Court appearances, your first court appearance in an adult court was at the Bairnsdale Magistrates' Court on 4 December 2013.  You were there charged with no less than ten offences, including two charges of criminal damage, one charge of contravening a family violence intervention order, two charges of unlawful assault, a further charge of contravening a family violence intervention order, two charges of handling or receiving stolen goods, and two charges of failing to appear on bail.

21You were placed on a community corrections order for a period of 12 months.  Conditions include that you perform 100 hours of unpaid community service work and that you be under the supervision of a community corrections officer and undergo rehabilitation and treatment in relation to drugs and mental health and offending behaviour.  

22A little under two years later on 4 August 2015, you were breached in relation to that community corrections order, and a sentence of four months imprisonment suspended for 12 months was imposed.  It is for that offending that I must impose that sentence of four months imprisonment.  I do not intend to impose any further sentence in relation to that breach other than to revive the suspended sentence.

23That offending for which you initially obtained a community corrections order is relevant to the offending involving violence of armed robbery. 

24You, Toby Blackburn, also have relevant prior criminal history.  There are a number of Children's Court appearances which initially I intended to put aside but they also involve relevant offending, including contravening family violence intervention orders as far back as August 2010.  Offences involving unlawful assault, although that charge was proven and dismissed, also in 2010, and matters concerning criminal damage by fire (arson).  More importantly, you have had no less than four court appearances in the Bairnsdale Magistrates' Court.  The first in September 2012, you were charged with criminal damage and dealt with by way of an adjourned undertaking without conviction.  Secondly, on 24 April 2013, theft, on that occasion you were dealt with by way of a $100 fine with conviction.  At your third court appearance on 27 August 2014, you were charged with criminal damage; that matter was dealt with by way of an adjourned undertaking without conviction.  Finally, on
30 September 2013, you were placed on a community corrections order for a period of 12 months, which I have averted to, in relation to criminal damage and unlawful assault.

25I have heard detailed pleas on both your behalves.  Those pleas indicate to me that, for different reasons, both of you have suffered from having a chaotic family background. 

26In your case, Jake McKay, the circumstances surrounding your background are set out both in the submissions of your counsel, Mr Anderson, and the psychological report of Mr Jeremey Parker, which became Exhibit JM2.  It is apparent that your father, Kevin McKay, was physically abusive and controlling of your mother.  You, loyal to your mother, felt obliged to intervene to protect her, but your father used threats and overt acts to stop you.  He was a violence alcoholic and drug addict.  He served a number of periods of imprisonment, including when you were but four years of age, he receiving a 12-month term of imprisonment.

27Your schooling was disrupted and you were expelled in Grade 4, but continued until Year 9.  As Mr Anderson writes in his submissions, your schooling was characterised by truancy.  Your mother and father separated some five years ago. 

28Your life was therefore one marked by violence in the family home, disruptive behaviour, and a chaotic existence.  Everything that one would expect to be normal was for you, in your life, abnormal.

29Your father is suffering from terminal cancer, and may die any day.

30Your drug use commenced at the age of 12 with cannabis, progressing to amphetamines at the age of 15 or 16, and then ice at the age of 18.  In the time leading up to this offending, you were using ice daily.  You have been in custody for some 140 days, including today.  You have had difficulties in prison, being attacked from behind and as a result you have been placed in Port Phillip Prison in a unit which caters for 18 to 25 year old men. 

31You have been engaged during that period of time in voluntary work some six days per week and you have attended Narcotics Anonymous.  Upon your release you aim to live with your mother, who is presently residing in a unit at a caravan park.

32In the psychological report of Mr Parker, he notes your family background, your drug use, and your explanation for offending.  In that regard he writes:

"Mr McKay recognised the stupidity of his actions and he expressed genuine remorse of the impact he has had on the victim as well as the ramifications for himself."

33In his opinion, you suffer from a persistent depressive disorder.  In the opinions section, he continues at paragraphs 30-31:

"It is my opinion that Mr McKay has experienced this disorder, as a result of the family violence during his childhood, and his drug abuse.  The culmination of family dysfunction and drug abuse have resulted in self-defeating personality traits and feelings of hopelessness. 

I am of the opinion that Mr McKay does experience depression and that such depression was as a result of the above as well as from a lack of appropriate social supports over the years. 

It is also my opinion that this depression existed throughout the period of time when the offending occurred and is likely to remain with him for an extended period of time.  While this chronic depression impacts negatively on Mr McKay's ability to think consequentially and, at times, act in socially appropriate and responsible ways, it cannot be causally linked to his offending; however, chronic depression should be viewed as being a significant contributing factor."

34He concludes in the last paragraph with this sentence:

"It is my view that such psychological and medical treatment is best provided for in the community."

35As to you, Toby Blackburn, you too have also had a chaotic and dysfunctional background, with one exception.  Your father and mother separated when you were born.  Your father has since died of a heroin overdose.  Having separated, your mother then commenced to live with Steven Warten, who was a drug addict with a lengthy criminal history.  You suffered physical and verbal abuse at the hands of your stepfather.  Both your stepfather and mother were heroin addicts.  You can recall being taken to Springvale whilst your mother and stepfather sought to ‘score’ heroin.

36In September 2002 you were removed from your mother and stepfather's care by the Department of Human Services in order to be in the care of your grandmother, whose evidence I have heard.  She was present yesterday and is present today with her husband.

37It is true to say that her evidence was impressive, not only in terms of what she said of you, but in terms of what she and her husband have done for you and what they offer you in the future.  She and her husband provided stability in circumstances where you had none before.  Your stepfather sought to train you in the ways of a criminal, teaching you how to steal and the like. 

38Your grandmother, Mrs Fenton, gave evidence of a particular occasion when in her house you were eight and a half years of age.  You had prepared to hang yourself and were ready to jump off a piece of furniture to effect that when she stopped you.  You said, "I'm useless, worthless".  She comforted you.  That such a tragic thing should happen so early in life demonstrates the nature of your life. 

39Although you have moved about, your grandmother and grandfather have been constants in your life, and they offer you accommodation when are released from custody.  You have indicated to her that you want to change your life and I accept that. 

40In the psychological report by Mr Parker, who also assessed you, he went through your family history, noting that both your mother and stepfather have been gaoled as a result of drug use and your alcohol and drug history notes that you commenced smoking cannabis and drinking alcohol from age 14.  He also notes in relation to you:

"Mr Blackburn recognised the stupidity of his actions and he expressed genuine remorse of the impact he has had on the victim as well as the ramifications for himself."

41He diagnoses you with suffering a mood disorder, namely Persistent Depressive Disorder.  He opines at paragraph 31, the following:

"It is my opinion that Mr Blackburn has experienced his disorder [Persistent Depressive Disorder], as a result of the family violence during his childhood, his parents' drug abuse, his mother's drug use, and from the abuse he received from his step-father.  The culmination of abuse, family dysfunction and disrupted living arrangements have resulted in self-defeating personality traits and feelings of being psychologically abandoned.  Mr Blackburn experiences levels of shame and feelings of worthlessness which leave him continually seeking approval."

42He continues a little later at paragraph 33:

"It is also my opinion that this depression existed throughout the period of time when the offending occurred and is likely to remain with him for an extended period of time.  While this chronic depression impacts negatively on Mr Blackburn's ability to think consequentially and, at times, act in socially appropriate and responsible ways, it cannot be causally linked to his offending; however, chronic depression should be viewed as being a significant contributing factor."

43I have come to the conclusion that in relation to both of you a period of imprisonment is required but that in addition a lengthy community corrections order is appropriate.  Each of you have been assessed as suitable for such an order.  I intend, subject to your consent, to make a community corrections order in relation to each of you for a period of three years. 

44As I have observed, each of you have pleaded guilty at the earliest reasonable opportunity.  I use that fact in relation to all your pleas as some evidence of your remorse and your desire to rehabilitate yourself, as well as for its utility in avoiding any trials or contested hearings on summary matters. 

45You have each, as I have observed, had chaotic lives, and that of course is a mitigating factor that I must, and do, take into account in assessing what I consider in total to be an appropriate sentence in relation to each of you.

46For both of you, you have moved from one short incident of offending which was dealt with in the Magistrates' Court, to offending involving an armed robbery, which as I have said, carries with it a maximum penalty of 25 years' imprisonment. 

47I accept however that this armed robbery is towards the lower end of such offending.  It is fortunate that the weapons that you took were used not in any way other than to intimidate Mr Anderson.

48But each of you committed that offending whilst on court orders and that of course is an aggravating feature.  It also speaks to the need to deter both of you from further offending, and the principle sentencing factor in this case, to deter others from offending such as this. 

49The court must denounce this type of offending and I am not confining myself simply to the charge of armed robbery but all the other offending for which you are to be dealt with today. 

50In addition, there must be an element of just punishment in the sentences that I impose upon you.  You are both young men.  You both, despite your backgrounds, have potential for the future.  It is in the interests of the community, as well as your own, that you be rehabilitated.  I am satisfied that both of you, despite having previously offended whilst on court orders, are determined to make good your lives.  I have made it as plain as I possibly can that if you do consent to the community corrections orders that I intend to allow you to be under, and you fail to comply with the conditions of those orders, you will be resentenced by me, and there is a high, if not very-high probability that you will be returned to gaol.  This is a matter which I have spent much time emphasising during the course of the pleas yesterday.  There will be a transcript of my sentencing remarks today available to me should either of you breach the community corrections orders. 

51This is your chance to make good of your lives.  When you will come out of gaol you will be in the community, you will be supervised and you will receive assistance.  You must make use of it.  If you do not, you will be back before me, reoffending, and this chance which I offer you will have been lost.

52Understand, as I have said, both of you, before you offer any consent to the community corrections order, that if you breach it, you will be brought back, not before a magistrate, not before another County Court judge, but before me. 

53Stand up, both of you.

54Jake McKay, on the charge of armed robbery, I sentence you to be imprisoned for a period of six months.  On the charge of breach bail, I sentence you to be imprisoned for a period of seven days.  On the charge of breach of the suspended sentence, I sentence you to be imprisoned for a period of four months. 

55I direct that the sentence of seven days on the breach of bail be served wholly concurrently with the six months.  I direct that two months on the sentence of four months for the breach of the suspended sentence is to be served concurrently with the sentence on the charge of armed robbery, producing a total sentence of eight months' imprisonment. 

56I declare, in relation to you, presentence detention of 139 days.  If you consent, I will further release you after that period of imprisonment on a three-year community corrections order, containing conditions that you perform 300 hours of unpaid community service work, that you are under the supervision of a community corrections officer, that you receive treatment in relation to drug, alcohol, mental health and offending behaviour programs as directed. 

57I further state that of the 300 hours community work, 150 of those 300 hours can be successfully completed by complying with, or attending, courses and the like.  Are you prepared to enter into that community corrections order,
Mr McKay?  Thank you, Mr McKay, you can be seated.

58In relation to you, Toby Blackburn, I sentence you also to be imprisoned for a period of six months.  As to the breach of the community corrections order, I sentence you to be imprisoned for a period of one month cumulatively on that six months.  In relation to the criminal damage charge and other matters, I sentence you to be imprisoned for a period of three months, and I direct that two months of that period be served concurrently, producing a total effective sentence also of eight months' imprisonment.

59I also am prepared to release you on a community corrections order in exactly the same terms of three years, as with Mr McKay.  Are you prepared to consent to such a community corrections order?

60OFFENDER:  Yes, Your Honour.

61HIS HONOUR:  Take a seat.  In relation to you, I declare presentence detention to be two days, and so far as both of you are concerned, but for your pleas of guilty, in each case, I would have sentenced you to a period of three years, with a minimum of two years.

62Now, any corrections or other matters that need to be attended to,
Mr O'Doherty?

63MR O'DOHERTY:  No, nothing arising out of that, Your Honour.

64HIS HONOUR:  Mr Anderson?

65MR ANDERSON:  No, Your Honour.

66HIS HONOUR:  Mr de Kretser?

67MR DE KRETSER:  No Your Honour, I think you have covered everything.

68HIS HONOUR:  I just want to make sure that what I have stated covers all the charges in relation to Mr Blackburn.  I do not think I have articulated it completely adequately in relation to Mr Blackburn, but the six months in relation to the armed robbery is, I think, straightforward.  The breach of the community corrections order of one month, I think, is straightforward.  The criminal damage - now, this is an aggregate sentence in relation to the indictment charge of criminal damage.

69MR O'DOHERTY:  Well, the indictment charge and the two summary charges, Your Honour.

70HIS HONOUR:  And the two summary charges, I was about to add.

71MR O'DOHERTY:  Yes, yes.

72HIS HONOUR:  Because that is part of the one - I am satisfied ‑ ‑ ‑

73MR O'DOHERTY:  One transaction, yes.

74HIS HONOUR:  One transaction.  So that will be an aggregate sentence in relation to that indictment charge of the criminal damage and the two related charges of breach of the family violence intervention orders.

75MR O'DOHERTY:  Yes.

76HIS HONOUR:  Which I did not properly ‑ ‑ ‑

77MR O'DOHERTY:  Deal with, no, no.

78HIS HONOUR:  ‑ ‑ ‑ articulate, but that will be appropriately recorded. 
Mr Anderson, is there anything you wish to correct or add?  Mr de Kretser?  Just a moment.  Mr de Kretser, do you have anything

79MR DE KRETSER:  No, it is just the - the March 2016 offending was three months with two months concurrent, that is my understanding.

80HIS HONOUR:  Yes, three months, two months concurrent.

81MR DE KRETSER:  Yes.

82HIS HONOUR:  So that then produces a total of eight months?

83MR DE KRETSER:  Yes, Your Honour, that is what I have.

84HIS HONOUR:  Yes.

85MR DE KRETSER:  And I understand how Your Honour has formulated that, so yes.

86HIS HONOUR:  Yes.  Now, if there is any technical difficulties with the way in which I have constructed the sentence, does anyone see any technical difficulties?

87MR O'DOHERTY:  No Your Honour, I am just going back to the community corrections order aspect.

88HIS HONOUR:  Yes.

89MR O'DOHERTY:  Your Honour has sentenced him for breach of the community corrections order.

90HIS HONOUR:  But not for the other matters.

91MR O'DOHERTY:  Does he have to be resentenced for the - or you can make no order.

92HIS HONOUR:  Yes, I think you are right.  I will take no further action in relation to that.

93MR O'DOHERTY:  Yes, I think that gets rid of that.

94HIS HONOUR:  That gets rid of that.  So I think that is open to me, is it not?

95MR O'DOHERTY:  I think it is, Your Honour, but - I understand what Your Honour is trying to achieve.  We all know that.

96HIS HONOUR:  Yes.  It is just whether I am going to achieve it this way.

97MR O'DOHERTY:  That is right, yes.

98HIS HONOUR:  Whether or not the one month should be in relation to the breach of the community corrections order, plus the ‑ ‑ ‑

99MR O'DOHERTY:  It would be a safer way of doing it, I think.

100MR DE KRETSER:  Plus a resentence, you cancel the old order, and place him on the new order for everything globally, if that - if we had some someone from Corrections ‑ ‑ ‑

101HIS HONOUR:  Do I have to do that?  So do I find - I simply find the charge proven?

102MR DE KRETSER:  Yes.

103HIS HONOUR:  Make ‑ ‑ ‑

104MR DE KRETSER:  You have got to resentence him as well in relation to the old offending, which we say globally is the one month, it is the breach plus the old offending.

105HIS HONOUR:  Well, if - for want of any clarity, I will make it one month for the breach plus the previous offending.

106MR DE KRETSER:  Yes.

107HIS HONOUR:  Does that fit?

108MR O'DOHERTY:  Yes.

109HIS HONOUR:  So that is an aggregate sentence.

110MR O'DOHERTY:  An aggregate sentence, Your Honour.

111HIS HONOUR:  In relation to the breach ‑ ‑ ‑

112MR O'DOHERTY:  The breach, and the resentencing. 

113HIS HONOUR:  And the resentencing?

114MR O'DOHERTY:  Yes.

115HIS HONOUR:  For the original offending.

116MR DE KRETSER:  And I think Your Honour has to cancel - normally someone from Corrections is here and knows everything that needs to be done, but I believe you also have to cancel the original order that was made in the Magistrates' Court in September of last year.

117HIS HONOUR:  Do I have to do that?

118MR O'DOHERTY:  I do not know, Your Honour, I cannot answer that.  But just cancel it, you may as well do it.

119HIS HONOUR:  Well, it will be noted that the original order is cancelled.

120MR O'DOHERTY:  Thank you.

121MR DE KRETSER:  As Your Honour pleases.

122HIS HONOUR:  Now, you have got your other orders that you were seeking - here they are.  I have made those disposal orders.

123MR O'DOHERTY:  Thank you, Your Honour.

124HIS HONOUR:  So each of you then understand you have each been sentenced to eight months' imprisonment, less the time that you have done in gaol, plus a community corrections order for a period of three years with the conditions that I have said.  How long will you take, Mr Brown, to have those orders ready?  Yes, there is some complications with the - all right, well look, I will stand down.  How long do you - Mr O'Doherty? 

125MR O'DOHERTY:  Sorry Your Honour, I just ‑ ‑ ‑

126HIS HONOUR:  Is there anything else, Mr O'Doherty?

127MR O'DOHERTY:  No, Your Honour.  No, thank you.

128HIS HONOUR:  Because of the - I will not say complexity, well, I will say the complexity of the orders, when they are in draft form, I will ask counsel to look at them to make sure that what I have done and what are the court orders cover the field, and appropriately so.  I think I will simply stand down until 12.30, I do not think there is much chance of anything happening with the orders until then or later.  There is still the matter of Brenan.

129MR O'DOHERTY:  That does not give us much ‑ ‑ ‑

130HIS HONOUR:  It does not give us any time at all.

131MR O'DOHERTY:  No, it is probably better to do something about Brenan now.

132(At this stage the court proceeded with another matter.)

133HIS HONOUR:  Should I stand down, Mr ‑ ‑ ‑

134MR O'DOHERTY:  Yes, Your Honour.

135HIS HONOUR:  We will temporarily adjourn.

136(Short adjournment.)

137HIS HONOUR:  Gentlemen, anything to say?

138COUNSEL:  No, Your Honour.

139HIS HONOUR:  Today's date is?  Excuse me for a moment.  So I have made those s.464ZF orders.

140MR O'DOHERTY:  Thank you, Your Honour.

141COUNSEL:  If Your Honour pleases.

142HIS HONOUR:  Now, the community corrections orders, firstly for Mr McKay?  Yes, gentlemen you can approach the dock in relation to the signing of these community corrections orders.  Yes, those are the orders.  Mr McKay and
Mr Blackburn, I have also made orders for the taking of a swab for DNA purposes by a police officer who may use reasonable force to effect it, if need be, but I have to apparently say these things, I do not know why.  And the formal orders of the court, Mr Brown?  And also in relation to Mr - and have you got the remand for Mr Brenan? 

143In relation to Mr Blackburn, you will note, constables, that there is a notation about his management in custody with suicidal ideation.  Nothing else, Mr O'Doherty?

144MR O'DOHERTY:  No, Your Honour.

145HIS HONOUR:  That covers it, Mr Anderson?

146MR ANDERSON:  Yes, Your Honour.

147HIS HONOUR:  Mr de Kretser?

148MR DE KRETSER:  Yes, Your Honour.

149HIS HONOUR:  Thank you both for your attendance.

150COUNSEL:  Thank you, Your Honour.

151HIS HONOUR:  You may remove both Mr McKay and ‑ ‑ ‑

152MR DE KRETSER:  Your Honour, if we could just provide them with copies of their orders, as ‑ ‑ ‑

153HIS HONOUR:  Absolutely.

154MR DE KRETSER:  ‑ ‑ ‑ as they are being taken away.

155HIS HONOUR:  2 o'clock Monday please, Mr Rouse.

‑ ‑ ‑