Director of Public Prosecutions v Hebert (a pseudonym)
[2021] VCC 1673
•22 October 2021
| IN THE COUNTY COURT OF VICTORIA AT LATROBE VALLEY CRIMINAL JURISDICTION | Revised Not Restricted Suitable for Publication |
| DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC PROSECUTIONS |
| v |
| ELIOT HEBERT (A PSEUDONYM) |
---
| JUDGE: | HIS HONOUR JUDGE DOYLE |
| WHERE HELD: | Latrobe Valley |
| DATE OF HEARING: | 4 October 2021 |
| DATE OF SENTENCE: | 22 October 2021 |
| CASE MAY BE CITED AS: | DPP v Hebert (a pseudonym) |
| MEDIUM NEUTRAL CITATION: | [2021] VCC 1673 |
REASONS FOR SENTENCE
---
Subject: CRIMINAL LAW - SENTENCE
Catchwords: Guilty Plea – Indecent Act with a Child Under 16 – Sexual Assault of a Child Under 16
Legislation Cited: Crimes Act 1958 s 47, s 49D(1); Crimes (Sexual Offences) Act 1991; Crimes Amendment (Sexual Offences) Act 2016; Sentencing Act 1991 s 6F; Sex Offenders Registration Act 2004
Cases Cited:Worboyesv The Queen [2021] VSCA 169
Sentence:Convicted and sentenced to nine months imprisonment, to be followed upon your release on a 18 month Community Corrections Order.
s6AAA declaration: 26 months with a minimum non-parole period of 18 months.
---
APPEARANCES: | Counsel | Solicitors |
| For the Director of Public Prosecutions | C. Duckett | Solicitor for the Office of Public Prosecutions |
| For the Accused | L. Andrews | Sullivan Braham Pty Ltd |
| To ensure there is no possibility of identification, this sentence has been anonymised by the adoption of pseudonyms in place of names of the accused, victims and family or witnesses. | ||
HIS HONOUR:
Introduction
Eliot Hebert[1], you have pleaded guilty to two charges of indecent act with a child under the age of 16 and one charge of sexual assault of a child under the age of 16. The maximum penalty for these offences is 10 years imprisonment. Charge 3 of sexual assault is a standard sentence offence. The standard sentence is four years.
[1]A pseudonym.
The Sexual Offender Registration Act applies, these offences are all class 2 offences and the applicable registration period in this matter is life.
Background
You are 77 years old. You were born in April 1944. There are three victims of your offences: Kayla Reed[2], who is now 41 years old born in April 1980; her sister Arissa Carty[3], who is now 38 years old; and Teresa Reed[4] is 16 years old; she was born in May 2005. Teresa Reed is Kayla Reed’s daughter. Your wife, is an aunt to Kayla Reed. Britney Carty[5] is Kayla and Arissa's mother.
[2]A pseudonym.
[3]A pseudonym.
[4]A pseudonym.
[5]A pseudonym.
During their childhood, Kayla and Arissa would regularly visit your home with their family. The families were close and would visit each other nearly every week.
You spent a lot of alone time with Arissa. You would buy her McDonalds and lollies and you took her on outings, including on a holiday to Mount Beauty.
Charge 1 - Kayla Reed (1992)
On a Saturday in 1992, Kayla, Arissa and Britney Carty and their father went to your house in Dandenong to stay overnight with you and your family. Kayla was 12 years old and Arissa was nine years old. You were 48 years old.
Kayla and Arissa were using the pool at your house and wearing their bathers. In the afternoon Kayla was playing with a hose near the pool. You approached her and grabbed the hose to squirt her with the water.
You were standing beside Kayla reaching across her from her left side holding the hose in your hand near her chest. She had developed breasts at that time. You moved your hand down inside her bathers underneath her breast before cupping her breast with your hand. She felt uncomfortable. She knew that nobody else should touch her on her breasts. She ducked away from you to get your hand out of her top. She went inside the house to get away from you.
Later that night she could not sleep because she kept thinking about what had happened. She woke up her mother and told her what you had done. The next day you approached Kayla and said something like, 'Sorry for yesterday'.
Charge 2 – Arissa Carty (1993/1994)
10.Between 1 January 1993 and 30 September 1994, when Arissa Carty was between nine and 11 years old and you were between 48 and 50 years old, you kissed Arissa Carty on the mouth at Mount Beauty.
11.You and your wife were at the Carty’s holiday house in Mount Beauty. You took Arissa fishing and kissed her on the mouth with your mouth open. She pulled away from you. In 1993 when she was ten years old and you were 49 years old, again at Mount Beauty, you tried to get Arissa to sit with you. She told you she did not want to. She did not speak to you much after that.
12.In mid-2017, Britney Carty asked Arissa Carty if you had done anything inappropriate to her when she was younger. Arissa Carty said yes but did not go into the details about what had happened; Britney Carty did not ask her anything about it.
13.When she made a statement and in her victim impact statement, Arissa Carty detailed that she has had a number of mental health issues throughout her life and that she had seen psychologists and psychiatrists to help her to deal with the trauma arising from the offending. She also said she used drugs in the past to help her deal with the trauma.
Charge 3 – Teresa Reed (2018)
14.On Friday 8 June 2018 for the Queen’s Birthday weekend, Kayla Reed, the first victim in these three offences, her husband and their two children went to a relative’s house in Patho for the long weekend.
15.At that time, their daughter Teresa was 13 years old. Present over the weekend were various relatives and their children and you and your wife. Teresa stayed in a caravan on the property with her family.
16.On Sunday 10 June 2018, everyone was in the lounge room in different areas including Teresa. Teresa was sitting on the floor with the other children watching television. You asked her to sit next to you on the couch which she did. She sat to the left of you with her legs together and her feet on the couch, her knees were together facing towards you. Her cousin was sitting next to her on her other side. Teresa was playing a game on her iPad which you began to watch and ask her about. You put your hand on her left knee. She did not think anything of it because you were family. You leaned towards Teresa while your hand was on her knee and asked her, 'What's that game?'. You continued leaning towards her with your hand on her leg, until your face was close to hers.
17.She tried to move her legs but could not because you were leaning on her with your hand. You started rubbing her leg with your hand and moved your hand up her leg from the inside of her knee towards her vagina. You placed your hand on her vagina over her leggings for approximately 10 seconds. You kept your hand still but moved your finger on her vagina. You pretended nothing was happening. She was squeezing her legs together to stop you, but you kept your hand there.
18.You asked her 'Did that feel good?'. She said no. She thought you then said, 'Do you want me to stop?'; and she replied, 'Yes.' She later realised that you must have asked her, 'Do you want me to do it again?'. You then put your hand on Teresa’s knee and moved it towards her vagina, until your hand was again touching her vagina over her leggings again. Your hand remained on her vagina for approximately ten seconds. By this time, she had turned off her iPad and was watching children in the room. You were looking at the television pretending that nothing was happening. Teresa squeezed her legs together to stop you from touching her, but you kept your hand on her vagina.
19.She then stood up and walked away. She did not say anything to you at the time because she did not want to cause drama. She left the house and walked to the caravan where her family were staying. Later that afternoon she tried to sleep but was not able to. During the night she told her mother what you had done. In the morning on Monday 11 June 2018, the family packed up and left the property.
20.Later in the afternoon, Kayla Reed called her mother and told her that you had touched Teresa.
21.On Tuesday 12 June Teresa’s father travelled to your house to confront you about touching Teresa, Kayla and Arissa. You denied touching Teresa or Kayla, but when confronted about Arissa you said, 'I don't want to talk about that'.
Police report
22.On Monday 25 June 2018 Arissa called the Dandenong Sexual Offences and Child Abuse Investigation Team and reported you.
23.On 18 July 2018 Teresa made a VARE statement to police. The investigation continued over 2018 and 2019 and Kayla and Arissa also made statements against you.
Arrest and interview
24.You were interviewed in January 2020. When asked about the incident with Teresa, you said she sat she sat next to you on the couch while she was playing a game on her iPad. You admitted putting your hand on her kneecap and leaning over to see the game she was playing. You said you asked her, 'Do you like that or something do you?' referring to the game. You said nothing further happened, and you denied touching her on the vagina over her clothing.
25.When you were asked about the incident with Kayla by the pool, you said you were having a water fight and grabbed the hose and sprayed her feet. You and her wrestled for the hose and it went down the front of her bathers. You were trying to get it back, so you put your hand down her top to where the hose had gone and touched the top of her breasts with your hand while holding the hose. You apologised. You denied that your hand went inside Kayla's bathers.
26.When asked about your relationship with Arissa when she was young, you said that you were pretty close; she was, 'Like a daughter'. You denied the allegation of sexual assault and said that Arissa was, ‘in a dream world’. You added, 'She got into drugs and prostitution’.
Victim impact statements
27.I have been provided with victim impact statements from all three complainants in this matter. Firstly, Teresa Reed indicates that she was shocked at your offending, shocked that something like that could ever happen to her. Because of her age, she was confused, and she did not realise what was happening. She was angry that this happened in front of other people. When she went back to school when sexual abuse was mentioned in class, she would become sad and closed off and it caused her to socially distance herself. She said the case has gone on for four years which has impacted her mental health.
28.She refers to the impact on her extended family and that her family does not spend Christmases with the extended family anymore. She had counselling, 10 to 15 sessions. She said making the statement to the police was the hardest thing she has ever had to do and that was traumatic for her.
29.Arissa Carty, in considerable depth, went into the impact of the offence on her; including significant impacts on her school attendance, the use of drugs, estrangement from her family, engaging in risky behaviours, parenting impacts and struggles with trauma over an extended period of time and she wonders how her life would have turned out if the offence had not happened.
30.Kayla Reed says that it is difficult to describe the emotional impacts of the crimes on her and her family because there are so many of them. She felt betrayed at the time of the offending against her because you had broken her trust. In a way, that made her somehow think she was in the wrong and that created further damage. It made her be alert after the crime. When the crime you committed against her daughter took place, she says that was more damaging to her psychologically than any other event in her life. She was angry and hurt because she felt responsible for it happening through not speaking up earlier and it brought to the surface all the unresolved feelings from what happened to her. She says, 'This will live with us and myself for the rest of our lives. I'll be less trusting of people and I will have to carry the burden of what happened to my daughter for the rest of my life.'
31.It is plain from the summaries of those victim impact statements that the impact of your offending has been very significant on the three victims in this matter, and it is an important matter in sentencing in this case.
Gravity of the offences
32.Assessing just the physical actions which constitute the offending in charges 1 and 2, your conduct whilst serious was at the lower end of the spectrum for such charges. Charge 3 in my opinion constitutes the most serious of the offences involving brazen touching over Teresa Reed's vagina over her clothing. The touching was not momentary. You persisted when she sought to resist and to ask a 13-year child, 'Does that feel good?' whilst you were touching her vagina in the presence of her family is a very disturbing comment to make.
33.In this offending, you were thinking only of your own sexual gratification and you were prepared to offend in the most brazen manner.
34.There are other aspects of the individual charges and the overall offending that are aggravating or serious.
35.First, there are multiple complainants.
36.Second, all these offences involve a breach of trust involving a close extended family socialising together regularly. Implicit trust was placed in you by the parents of the victims in this case and indeed also by your wife and the rest of those in the extended family. You breached their trust this in each of these offences.
37.The offending in charge 1 and charge 3 was brazen occurring in public with others around, particularly charge 3. In relation to charge 2, you were alone with Arissa Carty. Her parents allowed you to be alone with her because you were family and because you had established some sort of special relationship with her.
38.The breach of trust in the offending against Teresa is compounded by the fact that you had offended against her mother, Kayla, some 25 years earlier and apologised; and yet there you were many years later, a 74-year-old man, offending against her daughter. I do not view the apology you made after the offences against Kayla as demonstrating any genuine remorse given you offended against Arissa and then Teresa after this.
39.You have offended against two generations of your own female relatives. Your moral culpability for these breaches of trust is significant.
40.The impact of your offending, as I said earlier, has been substantial as set out in the victim impact statements. That impact relates not only to direct harm to the three victims but also in damaging the fabric of your extended family and your close family including your wife and children. They have severed ties with you. No doubt the revelation of this offending has destroyed the love and respect they had for you as a husband and a parent.
41.All the victims in this case were well under the age of 16. Kayla Reed was 12 years old; Arissa Carty was nine or ten years old, and Teresa Reed was 13 years old. The younger ages of the victims in this case is an aggravating factor.
42.Having regard to all these matters I regard your offending as serious.
Standard sentence
43.The standard sentence for sexual assault is four years. The standard sentence is a legislative guidepost and is applicable to an offence in the mid-range of seriousness, having regard only to its objective features. It is not a mandatory sentence, nor is it the primary sentencing consideration, or the starting point from which to add or subtract time. It is just one of the many matters to be considered by a court in the instinctive synthesis of all matters relevant to sentencing.
44.The law requires me to, ‘Identify fully the facts, matters and circumstances,’ which bear upon my decision as to the appropriate sentence and I have endeavoured to do that in some detail in these reasons for sentence. The sentence which I will impose on charge 3 is less than the standard sentence for sexual assault, and in arriving at the sentence, I have taken into account all of the matters I am required to consider under the Sentencing Act including the standard sentence. I have considered all mitigating factors which I will outline during the rest of this sentence.
45.Current sentencing practices remain a relevant factor for standard sentence offences, but I am constrained to only consider sentences passed after the introduction of the standard sentencing scheme. In this case, I have not been provided with sufficient cases to establish any meaningful range of current sentencing practices for the offence of sexual assault.
Plea of guilty and remorse
46.I accept you pleaded guilty to the charges at the earliest opportunity at the committal mention.
47.I accept your plea indicates a level of developing remorse, although it was not apparent at the time of the record of interview. You have however accepted responsibility for your actions and that is important in a case of this nature. Your plea shows a willingness to facilitate the course of justice. The utilitarian value of your plea is significant. It has spared the witnesses, particularly the complainants, the burden of giving evidence and having to relive the offending in this case.
48.Your plea carries a greater utilitarian benefit in the current circumstances where the court has a significant backlog of trials caused by the suspension of jury trial for long periods during the pandemic. In the case of Worboyes v The Queen, the Court of Appeal recognised that this should lead to a to palpable amelioration of sentence.
49.Your counsel, Ms Andrews, submitted that beyond your plea, you have exhibited remorse for this offending. She relied on a letter from your counsellor, Kim Dowse, dated 6 August 2021. You had been to one counselling session with her at that time. Ms Dowse says that you felt terrible, but you were only just starting to understand at that time how your conduct may have affected the victim. I indicate I have also had regard to the letter from Ms Dowse dated 11 October 2021, which was filed before this hearing, indicating you have attended a further four sessions of sex offender treatment.
50.In assessing your remorse, I cannot ignore that you denied these offences in your interview and in respect of Arissa Carty, you sought to focus on what you alleged were her personal difficulties when asked about these allegations. Given this and Ms Dowse’s comment that you are only starting to understand the impact of your offending, I am not satisfied that you have any more than developing remorse and I am not satisfied that you have genuine insight into your offending.
Character and absence of prior criminal history
51.You have no prior convictions and at the age of 77, I sentence you as a first-time offender. The absence of a criminal history is relevant to your prospects of rehabilitation and your character; however, the fact that you have committed sexual offences against children so many years apart does indicate a level of risk of further offending; I will return to that issue.
Personal circumstances
52.You were born in April 1944. You are now 77 years of age. Your parents had four children. You were the second youngest. Your parents and siblings are all deceased. You were born in Brunswick. Your family moved to Wagga Wagga for a period before returning to Melbourne.
53.You were an average student. You left school early to pursue an apprenticeship as a fitter and turner. You worked in that trade for most of your working life. You were also a publican in Williamstown, Euroa, Footscray and Bendigo. You returned to your trade and retired at the age of 67. I accept that you were a hardworking man and supported your family throughout those years.
54.You married your wife at the age of 20. You have three children and seven grandchildren. Your marriage broke down following the offending coming to light. Your children have also distanced themselves from you and now you have no contact with them.
55.Following the breakdown of your marriage, you moved to a unit in Wonthaggi. You now lead a quiet and isolated life really only leaving your unit for shopping and going for a walk, since the onset of the pandemic.
Health
56.I have been told and I accept you have several health issues including:
·Type 2 Diabetes
·Enlarged heart and irregular heartbeat – you had two stents placed in your coronary arteries three to four years ago.
·Cataracts for which you have previously undergone cataract surgery. These cataracts have returned and you require further surgery.
·High blood pressure.
·Arthritis resulting from a workplace accident where you fell from a ladder fracturing your pelvis and hip.
57.Ms Andrews submitted that your advanced age and physical condition would make imprisonment more burdensome for you than it would be for a younger person and I accept that submission. This will be your first time in custody and any period of imprisonment I impose will be served in the restrictive conditions which currently prevail in prison in response to the pandemic. Such conditions include lockdowns, the suspension of visits and limited programs and all of the matters set out in Ms Andrews written submissions.
58.I am satisfied that at your age and in the current circumstances, this, your first period of imprisonment will weigh heavily on you and I take that matter into account.
Delay
59.The offending against Teresa Reed was committed on 18 June 2018. The complaints were made to police between 25 June 2018 and 18 September 2018. You were not arrested and interviewed until 7 January 2020. You were not charged until December 2020.
60.I accept that this is a significant delay in respect of the laying charges after the interview and that there was also a considerable period between the initial statements and the interview. I take into account the stress and hardship after the interview of the looming prospect of imprisonment over such a lengthy period as a mitigating matter.
Consequences of your offending
61.I also accept that this, your first experience of the criminal process, at your advanced age will operate as a significant personal deterrent to you against further offending.
62.As a result of the stress of these proceedings, you attempted to commit suicide by ingesting a large amount of Panadeine Forte and two days later, you cut your left wrist. You were in hospital for 12 days. I have read and had regard to the Alfred Health Discharge summary dated 19 April 2021 which was tendered on the plea. I regard this matter as an indication of the stress you have been under during the period you have had to wait for the resolution of these matters, and I take that matter into account.
63.As indicated above, the breakdown of your marriage of 55 years and losing contact with your children is a consequence of this offending. You are currently estranged from your children and grandchildren. These matters though are a not unexpected consequence of your offending.
Prospects of rehabilitation
64.I have received a letter from Kim Dowse, psychologist, who has been providing you with counselling. She says in her letter or report which was tendered on the plea, that you initially minimised your offending against your female nieces, referring to the historical offending but you agreed with her that you had touched your grandniece's vagina over her clothes more recently. You said to Ms Dowse you were pleading guilty because you wanted court to be over and done with. So, she said you minimised the actions but accepted your behaviour was probably inappropriate. You told her you had avoided thinking about the girls involved and you did not appreciate the effect of your actions on them.
65.She said you were upset by the knowledge that you had never negatively affected the victims and their families. You said you felt terrible, but you were only just starting to understand how your conduct may have affected them. Ms Dowse indicated she is committed to continuing regular contact with you. She believes you are committed to not reoffending and as I said, you have now had further counselling sessions with Ms Dowse. It is clear from that letter from Ms Dowse, your insight was lacking and at that point anyway your remorse was unclear.
66.David Ball, forensic psychologist, noted that the letter from Ms Dowse indicated that you had not developed any meaningful insight into your offending behaviour. He said you expressed perfunctory regret and remorse for your offending, simply saying, 'I'm sorry.' Mr Ball said the main protective factors that apply to you are the completion of a sex offender treatment program. He said you would greatly benefit from developing the understanding of the effects of sexual abuse on your alleged victims.
67.He said that during the course of your offending, you would have satisfied the diagnostic criteria for a paedophilic disorder, sexually attracted to females but he said that he did not consider the condition to be extant. I find this a puzzling conclusion in the context of the more recent offending and in my view, you are still a risk to reoffend.
68.Your lack of insight into your offending is concerning and I am of the view that a risk of reoffending remains were you be in the company of young female children and early adolescents.
69.However, given your current life circumstances – living alone and isolated in a flat in Wonthaggi - it seems to me unlikely you will be in a position to associate with female children. I accept Mr Ball’s opinion that participation in a sex offender’s course will also operate as protective factor.
70.It is encouraging that you have sought out counselling and I take into account Ms Dowse's opinion that you are committed to not reoffending. I think you have reasonable prospects of rehabilitation provided you can meaningfully participate in the sexual offender's program.
Submissions
71.Turning to submissions, Ms Andrews, in her comprehensive plea on your behalf submitted that in light of your advanced age; the absence of prior convictions; your plea of guilty; and what she submitted were your prospects of rehabilitation, that the purposes of sentencing could be achieved by a community correction order alone. She emphasised your rehabilitation.
72.The prosecutor, Ms Duckett, submitted that the gravity of the offending dictates that only a period of immediate imprisonment fulfils the purposes of sentencing. She submitted though that a combination sentence of imprisonment and a community correction order was within the range of available sentences.
73.Accordingly, I had you assessed for a community correction order. I intend to impose a combination sentence, Mr Hebert.
74.I indicate that in relation to charge 3 you will be sentenced as a serious sexual offender. This means that community protection is the primary sentencing purpose and any sentence I impose for charge 3 must be cumulative unless otherwise ordered. That you are to be sentenced as a serious sexual offender for that charge will be noted in the records of the court. I state that I see no reason to impose a disproportionate sentence in this case and nor has it been submitted that I should do so.
75.General deterrence and specific deterrence are important sentencing principles in this case- specific deterrence, less so given your age, the absence of prior convictions, the serious personal consequences for you of being charged and the deterrent effect of the criminal process, including the delay. Just punishment is important here given the serious impact of your offending on the three victims. I must express the Court's denunciation of your conduct where you offended for your own sexual gratification at the expense of innocent children. I must also take into account your rehabilitation and the sentence I will impose allows for that.
76.I have decided that in relation to the offences that go back to the 1990s when suspended sentences were open, given the particulars of those charges, a suspended sentence is open, but not so in relation to charge 3. A suspended sentence, Mr Hebert, will have the effect of hanging over your head a period of imprisonment for a period of years if you were minded to re-offend. In relation to charge 3, the offending against Teresa Reed, I intend to impose a period of imprisonment combined with a community correction order.
77.The sentences that I impose are as follows: In relation to charge 1, offending against Kayla Reed, you are sentenced to be imprisoned for a period of four months. That sentence is wholly suspended for two years. In relation to charge 2, indecent act against Arissa Carty, you are sentenced to be imprisoned for four months. That sentence is wholly suspended for two years. In relation to charge 3 of committing a sexual assault in respect of Teresa Reed, balancing the gravity of this offence against the mitigating features that apply, I sentence you to be imprisoned for a period of nine months. I also sentence you to a community correction order and the conditions of that order will be offending behaviour programs, mental health programs and supervision. I will correct what I said - in order to complete the sexual offender's program, the length of the community correction order must be 18 months, so that will be the length of that community corrections order.
78.You have to consent to that, Mr Hebert. I will have the order printed up and you can sign that order. Mr Sullivan can take it down to you. It has got supervision as a condition, programs for mental health as a condition and offending behaviour programs and what I have in mind is that you participate in the sexual offender's program on that community correction order. It is important that you understand that if you do not comply with those conditions, you will be brought back before me, the community correction order could be cancelled on a contravention, the sentence of imprisonment could be vacated and I would then be in a situation where I would have to resentence you for that offence, Mr Hebert. So, you must keep that in mind. In a moment, I will go through the core conditions with you. But for your plea of guilty, I would've sentenced you to 26 months with a minimum non-parole period of 18 months.
79.We'll just have that document printed out. Mr Hebert, you must serve nine months after which you're on a community correction order for 18 months. You're also subject to two suspended sentences for a period of two years, which means that if you commit any offence punishable by imprisonment in that two years, you will be liable to serve the period of the sentences that I've suspended. Are other orders needed, Ms Duckett?
80.MS DUCKETT: There are no other orders, Your Honour.
81.HIS HONOUR: Look, you'll also - Mr Hebert, we'll provide you with the sex offender's registration documentation. You'll be asked to sign that, all right? Can I just check -it'll be Wonthaggi, will it? Yes. We've just got to print out the document. Just in relation to the core conditions, you'll have to report to Wonthaggi Correctional Services at 7 Korumburra Road, Wonthaggi at the conclusion of your sentence. You can't commit another offence for which you can be imprisoned during the community corrections order, so that's 18 months after your release, as well you've got the suspended sentence hanging over your head. You have to comply with any requirements of the sentencing regulations. You have to report to and receive visits from Corrections. You must report to Community Corrections within two working days of your release from prison. You have to let Corrections know if you change your address or your job.
82.You can't leave Victoria without getting Corrections' permission. You have to obey all lawful instruction and directions of the secretary. You are under the supervision of a corrections officer for 18 months. You must undergo any mental health assessment and treatment, including psychological, neuropsychological, psychiatric treatment in a hospital or a residential facility as directed. You must participate in programs and courses addressing factors relating to the offending as directed and as I said, I have in mind a sex offender's program. The mental health, Mr Hebert, there's clearly identified factors in respect of your mental health on the plea, so I've made that condition as well. As I indicated, it's noted in the records of the court that in relation to charge 3, you are sentenced as a serious sexual offender.
83.MR SULLIVAN: May I approach him?
84.HIS HONOUR: Yes, certainly, Mr Sullivan. Ms Duckett, do you have to be somewhere else? Sorry, this took longer than I thought.
85.MS DUCKETT: No, no. We're stood down till 10.30, Your Honour. They don't have anyone to hear the matter as yet. Thank you for the enquiry, Your Honour.
86.HIS HONOUR: Thanks, Mr Sullivan. All right. Mr Hebert can go into custody now, thank you. Thanks Mr Sullivan and Ms Duckett, I'll stand down until we hear from the jury.
0