Director of Public Prosecutions v Clumsee

[2015] VCC 764

IN THE COUNTY COURT OF VICTORIA  Revised
(Not) Restricted
 Suitable for Publication

AT MELBOURNE
CRIMINAL JURISDICTION

CR 15-00773
CR 14-01613

DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC PROSECUTIONS

v

BRITTANY CULMSEE
PETER HALL

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JUDGE:	HIS HONOUR JUDGE BOURKE
WHERE HELD:	Melbourne
DATE OF HEARING:
DATE OF SENTENCE:	15 May 2015
CASE MAY BE CITED AS:	DPP v Clumsee
MEDIUM NEUTRAL CITATION:	[2015] VCC 764

REASONS FOR SENTENCE
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Subject:
Catchwords:
Legislation Cited:
Cases Cited:
Sentence:

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APPEARANCES:	Counsel	Solicitors
For the Office of Public Prosecutions	Mr A. Rooney
For Accused CLUMSEE	Mr K. Doyle
For Accused HALL	Ms Hancock

HIS HONOUR:

1Peter Hall, you are to be sentenced for one charge of kidnapping, one charge of armed robbery and one charge of possessing a drug of dependence, being methyl amphetamine.  The relevant maximum sentences are 15 years imprisonment for kidnapping, 25 years imprisonment for armed robbery and 12 months imprisonment for possessing methyl amphetamine. 

2Brittany Culmsee, you are to be sentenced for one charge of assault, three charges of theft and one charge of reckless conduct endangering  serious injury.  The relevant maximum sentences are five years' imprisonment for assault and the reckless conduct charge and ten years imprisonment for theft.

3Hall, you pleaded guilty before me on 20 April 2015.  When interviewed by police on 3 January 2014, you did not admit the offending.  You pleaded not guilty at committal in September 2014.  The matter was listed for trial in this court.  It resolved shortly before the trial date and you pleaded to an indictment  E10033613 alleging these three offences. 

4That plea has facilitated the interest of justice, particularly in that a trial, at that time involving four accused,  was avoided. 

5Culmsee, on 21 April, you pleaded guilty before me to the assault charge and two charges of theft, on Indictment C1409440A.1.  On 24 April, you pleaded guilty to the reckless conduct offence on Indictment C1409440B.  On the same indictment, you pleaded not guilty to armed robbery and theft.  A trial ran and on 1 May, a jury returned verdicts of not guilty for armed robbery and guilty for theft.  At committal in September 2014, you had entered pleas of not guilty to a number of charges.  Charges including kidnapping and intentionally causing injury have not proceeded against you. 

6You both receive  the benefit of your pleas of guilty and the level of co-operation those histories of the proceedings against each of you show.

7At your plea hearings, which both ran on 5 May, Mr Doyle for the Crown tendered two summaries of prosecution opening.  They are marked Exhibit A on Indictments E10033613 and C1409440A.1 and Exhibit B on Indictment C1409440B.

8Mr Chisholm for you,  Peter Hall, tendered certificates related to rehabilitation programs and negative urine drug testing in remand custody and the psychological report of Michael Bilyk,  dated 9 June 2012.  Yes, you might need to check that date somebody.  I might get my associate to, but I have an idea it was December.  Anyway, I will move on and return to my sentencing reasons.

9Mr Lawson for you, Brittany Culmsee, tendered drug screen testing results for the period December 2014 to April 2015,  (they are in the great majority negative),  the letter of Susan Simpson dated 27 April 2015 and a police photograph of you taken upon your arrest in January 2014.  Mr Lawson also provided me with a written outline of plea submissions.

10The circumstances of your offending are set out in the tendered Crown summaries Exhibit A and B.  My own summary may therefore be shorter.

11In the period of your offending in early January 2014, you were both aged 20 years.  There were two episodes of offending,  on 3 and 10 January 2014.  On 29 April 2015, I sentenced a co-offender named Daniel Piccolotto who was involved on both occasions.

12My sentencing reasons state some of the circumstances relevant to your offences.  My remarks are directed to him. 

"The offences occurred on or between 31 December 2013 and 10 January 2014.  You knew a number of persons who lived in the Reservoir,  Coburg area.  They included your brother Jason Piccolotto, Brittany Culmsee, Peter Hall, Crystal May-Sutton, the victim of the car theft on or about 3 January,  (and related to the events leading to your assault of Shady Karam on 10 January), Mohammad Akkari and James Pieri. 

There seems to have developed at this time ill feeling and grievance between persons within both groups.  These related to a stolen car, a loan of cars and money and perhaps romantic affiliation.  The disputes may not, in fact seem not to have been connected.  Motivations behind the machination between these persons are not clear to me.

In short, in such a context, Culmsee took May-Sutton's Honda motor vehicle.  Theft by you and her was effected at least by 3 January, when you were seen in the car.  You and she seemed to have kept possession for some days.  During that time, you and Culmsee drove away without paying for and thereby stealing petrol at a Coles Express Service Station in Tullamarine.  This was on 3 January.  The car was recovered by police on 11 January.

On the night of 9 January, into the early hours of 10 January, you were at the home of James Pieri in Reservoir.  Culmsee, Karam, Pieri and at times others were there.  There was dispute about money and cars.  At one point, in this context  but without very clear explanation it seems to me, you struck Karam over the head with a full bottle of whiskey.  He suffered minor injuries".

13As stated,  Culmsee, you were Piccolotto's co-offender on the theft of May-Sutton's car and the theft of petrol.  They are Charge 3 and 4 on Indictment C14094408.A.1.  The events of 3 January involved more than the theft of May-Sutton's car. 

14In the early hours of that date, you, Hall, I would find acting with others, arranged a meeting with May-Sutton at or near an address in Reservoir.  Jason Piccolotto was also there,  in a four wheel drive vehicle.  You, Hall, pushed May-Sutton, a small slightly  built young woman into the car.  It was driven a short distance, at or near to a park or reserve.  You, Culmsee, arrived in May-Sutton's vehicle and with Daniel Piccolotto.  After a short time, you entered the four wheel drive and began to assault May-Sutton.  You, Hall, out of the car, had by then produced a firearm.  You were pointing the gun and threatening to shoot.

15May-Sutton took a small pizza knife she had seen in the car and struck at you, Culmsee.  You were cut to the right cheek, near the eye.  You desisted and got out.  You, Hall, were making further threats to kill May-Sutton.  These are to be treated as part of or related to the kidnapping and armed robbery charges.  May-Sutton got out of the car and started running.  You, Hall, gave chase,  May-Sutton stopped at a street corner and turned.  She held her mobile phone online for some time to “OOO”.  Still holding the gun, you  demanded and took the phone.  You walked away back to the vehicles.  May-Sutton ran to a nearby home and was assisted there.  Unsurprisingly, she was seen by the householders to be very frightened about what your group was going to do to her. 

16Paragraph 26 of Exhibit A states May-Sutton's injuries.  There was swelling, tenderness and some bruising to her head and the side of her face. 

17Hall, upon arrest on 3 January you were found to be in possession of three small ziplock bags of methyl amphetamine.  It is not challenged that the drug was for your own use. 

18You, Hall, were not present and involved in the events of 10 January.  As stated in my sentencing remarks for Daniel Piccolotto, you,  Culmsee were there at Pieri's home.  Immediately after Piccolotto struck Shady Karam with the bottle, Pieri forced Karam across the room and held a playing dart and what was described at your trial as a crack or drug pipe against the sides of his neck.  Pieri demanded his car keys.  You, Clumsee, came and stood beside Pieri and made the same demand.  Karam produced and you snatched the keys.  You went outside to his vehicle, a Ford Sedan hired by his partner under an insurance arrangement,  and drove away.  There was a passenger named Rose Liougas.  She has not been charged. 

19The jury at trial acquitted you of armed robbery of the keys, presumably not satisfied sufficiently of an agreement to commit that crime between you and Pieri or,  perhaps more likely, intention on your part to permanently deprive Karam of the keys.  You were convicted of stealing his car.  That offence does not require such an intention to deprive.

20In short, you drove to Karam's house, also in Reservoir.  You had been staying there with Daniel Piccolotto for a short time, although I would find not as welcome guests.  Unable to get entry, you drove away.  A short distance from the house, you were observed by police,  who sought to intercept.  A car chase followed during which you travelled at estimated speeds of up to 170 kilometres per hour.   You had a minor collision, turning out of High Street,  Reservoir and fled on foot.  Liougas was left in the car, one surmises shaken and frightened.  You were found and arrested nearby.  The theft of Karam's Ford hire car is Charge 4 on Indictment C1409440B.  The driving described is the reckless conduct charge, at Charge 5.

21It was not strongly emphasised on behalf of either of you;  however I would find that you were both using drugs,  likely methyl amphetamine, during the period and at time of offending. 

22No victim impact statements have been tendered.

23Peter Hall, you are now 21 years of age and presently placed in remand custody at the Melbourne Remand Centre.  You have been in custody since arrest, now over 16 months.  Mr Chisholm provided some detail of your circumstances in custody over that time.  I find that those circumstances should be seen as hard for a still young 20 to 21 year old man.

24The 2012 psychological report of Michael Bilyk describes the circumstances of your early life.  Your parents separated when you were five.  Your father is described as a violent alcoholic.  You have a sister who,  as at 2012, had no criminal history.  You left school after Year 10.  By then, you had gravitated toward drug and alcohol use and anti-social peers.  Employment since school has not been consistent or successful.

25Your prior criminal record filed with the indictment states between April 2012, when you were 18, and  in October 2013  three court appearances.  In June 2012 and October 2012 you received Youth Justice Centre sentences,   the first for the offence of intentionally causing serious injury.  There are no community youth justice orders in your history.  There are subsequent court appearances.  On 24 January 2014, on appeal, you were fined for criminal damage.  On 13 May 2014, you were sentenced to four months imprisonment, wholly suspended for 12 months, for offending which occurred in August to October 2013.  Offences included handling and carrying a dangerous article.  These subsequent matters have some, but limited relevance, for example to consideration of rehabilitation in your case.

26Mr Bilyk's psychological report, although I note dated in 2012 when you were 18, states a likely history of so called conduct disorder, symptoms of anti-social personality disorder and of post-traumatic stress disorder related to a  cousin's motor vehicle accident death.  Testing indicated elevated levels of anger.  Mr Chisholm stated to me, post 2012, a continuing decline into drug use.

27Peter Hall, this was very serious offending.  As I have said to Piccolotto,   the background to the offending against May-Sutton is murky.  However, on their terms, your offences against her were highly frightening, cowardly and quite brutally without care for her vulnerability.  She was outnumbered, fearful of you and your weapon and treated shamefully.  That you and the other perpetrators were former friends or associates likely added to her distress.

28Such offending makes relevant the sentencing considerations of deterrence, (both general and specific deterrence), your moral culpability, denunciation of what you did and the need for proportionate punishment.

29I also take into account moderating factors.  In your case, those include the following. 

1.  Your plea of guilty.

2.  Your difficult personal history.

3.  Your still relative youth.  For example, at 20 when you offended, a further       Youth Justice Centre order was at least jurisdictionally,  available to you.  Your situation and Mr Bilyk's 2012 psychological assessment makes it difficult to be optimistic about your prospects for rehabilitation.  However, at your age, you should still be seen as capable of that and,  consistent with other sentencing considerations, your rehabilitation should be encouraged.  I also take into account, given your age, the burden of adult custody already undergone.

30Mr Chisholm raised the principles  stated in the now well-known case of Boulton & Ors v R.  Ultimately, after doing the best I can to weigh what I see to be the relevant and competing factors, I have found that the balance between requisite punishment and attempt at rehabilitation can be met by a combined sentence of imprisonment and a community corrections order.

31Stand up please, Mr Hall.  Dealing with Indictment E10033613, on Charge 1 kidnapping, you are sentenced to 12 months imprisonment.  On Charge 2, armed robbery, to 18 months imprisonment.  On Charge - what ‑ ‑ ‑

32MR ROONEY:  Three.

33HIS HONOUR:  Well is it 3?

34MR ROONEY:  It is, Your Honour.  I've made the amendments, it's Charge 3.

35HIS HONOUR:  Thank you.  On Charge 3, possessing a drug of dependence, one month's imprisonment.  I direct that three months of the sentence for Charge 1 be served cumulatively on the sentence of Charge 2.  That is a total effective sentence of 21 months.  I declare 497 of pre-sentence detention.

36In addition, I impose a community corrections order of three years duration, commencing after your release from prison.  The usual terms apply and there will be additional or special conditions,   that you perform unpaid community work of 350 hours over that three years;  that there be assessment and treatment including testing for drug use and dependence;  that you be under supervision;  that there be a curfew condition running for three months after your release, which I expect to be in about four and a half months' time as I do my arithmetic, but that may not be right;  that there be mental health assessment and treatment and that you undergo appropriate offending behaviour programs as directed.  All right, could you take a seat now, we will deal with the necessary formalities of that later.

37Had you not pleaded guilty, I would have imposed a sentence of five and a half years, with a minimum term of three and a half years in prison.  That would mean, it seems to me, you would have over two years to go.

38Now there are other orders that you seek.  Not a forensic sample order for him Mr Rooney?

39MR ROONEY:  No, Your Honour.

40HIS HONOUR:  I always get worried when barristers are looking at legislation.  Is there something I have overlooked?

41MR ROONEY:  No, look this is of no moment, however the kidnapping charge is common law.  It's a 25 year maximum.  I think Your Honour might have said 15 years, but it is - - -

42HIS HONOUR:  Well I did say 15 because I was told it was 15 years.

43MR ROONEY:  Yes, you might have been, Your Honour.

44HIS HONOUR:  I see.

45MR ROONEY:  I've just looked at the - it's 25.

46HIS HONOUR:  Well it should reflect the ‑ ‑ ‑ 

47MR ROONEY:  The maximum.

48HIS HONOUR:  ‑ ‑ ‑ maximum.  I think I should impose therefore - I was told 15 years.  I usually check, but I did not.   Are you sure it's 25?

49MR ROONEY: Yes, s.320 of the Crimes Act.

50HIS HONOUR:  Yes.  It won't make any difference to the total effective sentence, but I think - I do not see very much - I did not see very much difference between the seriousness of the kidnapping which ran over - I took to be running over a period of time really and the armed robbery and the gun had relevance to both.

51The reduction was in large part, if not in full part, related to the maximum sentence.  I think I should sentence him to 18 months on both and make the same order for cumulation which would mean the same period of 21 months.

52MR ROONEY: I'm looking here at the s.320, kidnapping. "Common law offence, kidnaping is Level 2, 25 years".

53HIS HONOUR:  All right, well I was told 15, at least that is what I wrote down.  All right, I am going to resentence you.  It will not make any difference to the total.  On Charge 1, kidnapping, you are sentenced to 18 months imprisonment.  On Charge 2, armed robbery, 18 months' imprisonment.  On Charge 3, possessing a drug of dependence, one month's imprisonment.  I direct that three months of the sentence for Charge 1 be served cumulatively on the sentence for Charge 2.  That is a sentence of 21 months imprisonment and I declare 497 days of pre-sentence detention and I do not think I need to repeat the details of the community corrections order.  Thank you for bring that to my attention, I am grateful to you.

54MR ROONEY:  Thank you.

55HIS HONOUR:  I think I have announced and will not announce again what the sentence would have been,  had you not pleaded guilty.  All right.

56Brittany Culmsee, you are now 22 years of age.  You presently lived with your maternal grandparents in Watsonia.  You are on bail for these matters, with strict conditions which particularly include a nightly curfew between 8 pm and 6 am.  You have been so placed on bail since late November 2014. 

57You were raised in the Watsonia area.  You have one younger sister and three half siblings aged quite young.  There was an older brother who died as a child.  Your parents separated when you were about 13.  You left school in Bundoora during Year 11.  You have since worked at McDonalds as a waitress and in other casual employment.  I was told that you have no work qualifications.

58You have no prior criminal record; however I was informed that there was a subsequent court appearance on 28 October 2014 for, as I was told, a consolidation of offences including burglary, theft, handling and obtaining property by deception.  At the Heidelberg Magistrates' Court, you received a sentence of 165 days with a declaration of that time already served.

59As I understand the chronology of your custody since arrest for these matters before me, that sentence was imposed whilst you were in remand custody.  Upon arrest for these matters on  11 January 2014, you were remanded until 11 April 2014.  You were further remanded from 17 May to 28 November when granted bail by Judge Hannan of this court.  As stated, that bail has carried strict conditions including a curfew and,  I was told regular urine drug testing. 

60As pointed out by Mr Lawson, you had no criminal offending until mid to late 2013, aged 20.  The offending for which you received 165 days imprisonment in October 2014 was committed between October to December of 2013 with some emphasis, I would accept,  on the latter part of the period.  These offences, for which I am to sentence you, were committed if not within, very close to that period.  Accordingly, Mr Lawson placed strong emphasis upon the principle of totality as it should effect my sentence.  You have, he said, spent about nine months of the sixteen months since these offences in custody.  One hundred and twenty-two days (or four months)  are remand specific to these offences.  That nine months in custody, he pointed out, is referrable to offending over about four months in late 2013 to early 201, including these matters.

61I refer to and rely upon my earlier description and remarks about the 3 January offending by Hall, but also by you and the others.  Much of it applies to your role, although perhaps moderated by the fact that you face lesser offences than Hall with,  for example, lesser maximum sentences applicable.

62I see your 10 January offences as serious also.  Accepting the jury verdict, you exploited the quite dire situation in which your victim Shady Karam found himself.  As stated, the motivations for all of this are not clear.  Yet I note that Karam had allowed you the haven of staying at his and his partner's home in the days earlier  when you were sought by police for 3 January offences.

63The sentencing considerations,  for example,  of deterrence I have identified earlier  in respect of Peter Hall apply to you also, perhaps with some moderation compared to him.  The mitigating or moderating factors for you are as follows. 

1.  Your pleas of guilty.  This does not apply to the theft of Karam's motor     vehicle on 10 January. 

2.  Your hitherto good record; that is,  prior to September 2013. 

3.  I find that you have genuine prospects for rehabilitation.  You have that    prior good record and I accept that you have fundamentally complied with      your bail,  now over about five months.  I feel that that it is fair to say that       your conditions of bail have also been a relevant punishment.  You seem to    have family support and some prospects for employment.

4.  I must apply as I have said, the principle of totality.  That you have not      offended until the relatively limited period from September 2013 to January 2014 adds force to that.

64The principles  stated in Boulton v R were also raised in your case.  It is not challenged by the Crown that they have appropriate application. 

65Ultimately, I have decided, despite and still taking into account  the seriousness of your offences and the adverse sentencing considerations I have identified, that your proper total sentence should be a combined sentence of imprisonment and a community corrections order;  but such a total sentence that does not require your return to prison.

66The individual prison sentences or custodial components of that combined sentence may appear light;  however I feel that they should be measured in the light of the principle of totality and those principles stated in Boulton. 

67I sentence you as follows.

68On Indictment C1409440A.1, on Charge 2, assault, you are sentenced to three months imprisonment.  On Charge 3, theft of a motor vehicle, two months imprisonment.  On Charge 4, theft of petrol, one month's imprisonment.  On Indictment C1409440B, on Charge 4, theft  three months imprisonment.  On Charge 5, reckless conduct endangering serious injury, on month's imprisonment.

69I direct that one month of the sentence for Charge 2 on the first indictment, be served cumulatively on Charge 4 on the second indictment.  That is a total effective sentence of four months.  I declare pre-sentence detention of four months.  In addition, I impose a community corrections order of two years duration beginning from today.

70The usual terms apply.  The special or conditions are that you perform unpaid community work of 250 hours over that period of two years.  That there be assessment and treatment, including testing for drug use and dependence.  That you be under supervision.  That you engage in relevant offending programs as directed and that there be a judicial monitoring condition and I will set a date for that hearing in due course.

71Now Mr Rooney, you sought a forensic sample order for Culmsee?

72MR ROONEY:  Yes, Your Honour.

73HIS HONOUR:  As with many offences, this is the sort of offending  investigation of which is quite often assisted by such forensic information.  So bearing in mind, the nature and seriousness of the offences, I would make the order.  Is it opposed?  I don't think it is, is it?  All right.

74Now that means this, at a time - two weeks after today and four weeks - within four weeks after that.  So six weeks in total, you will have to attend at the Greensborough Police Station I think, excuse me.  A different language is used these days, Mr Rooney, it doesn't matter I'm just getting used to it.

75So the period of time is the period of four weeks commencing 28 days, that is four weeks after today and the police station would be Greensborough would it?  That is where she's been attending for bail I think.

76MR ROONEY:  As I understand it, that's the closest police station to Ms Culmsee's residence.

77HIS HONOUR:  Yes.  All right, now I've stated my reasons for making the order so I'll sign it now.

78MR ROONEY:  And Your Honour, there's also the disposal for Ms Culmsee too.

79HIS HONOUR:  There's a disposal order for Mr Hall's phone.

80MR ROONEY:  Your Honour, that'll be a joint order.

81HIS HONOUR:  All right and those documents will be sent to me in chambers right?

82MR ROONEY:  I'll email those to Your Honour's associate.

83HIS HONOUR: All right, yes. Well I've signed those two orders. All right, now Ms Culmsee you can come out and sit next to - come out of the dock rather and sit next to or near Mr Lawson and we'll deal with Mr Hall's community corrections order first. I suppose I should look at that section. I am not doubting you at all. Is it in the Crimes Act or the Sentencing Act?

84MR ROONEY:  In terms of the ‑ ‑ ‑

85HIS HONOUR:  The common law section?

86MR ROONEY: It's the Crimes Act, s.320.

87HIS HONOUR:  Thank you.

88MR ROONEY:  Sometimes it's best not to review these cases the morning before, Your Honour.

89HIS HONOUR:  Yes, now what have we got?  This is it here, is it?

90ASSOCIATE:  Yes.

91HIS HONOUR:  Yes, thank you.  Yes, stand up Mr Hall.  Now I have sentenced you to 21 months imprisonment, but at the end of the period which you still owe on that, you will be placed on a community corrections order.  That will run three years from then and the usual terms that attach is that you must attend at the Greensborough Community Corrections Office, it is stated here, within two clear working days after your release.

92Now you will be contacted in prison about this by Community Corrections and there are also these terms.  You must not commit another offence for which you could be imprisoned during the time.  You must comply with an obligation that means you may not attend any appointment, supervision or program effected by alcohol or drugs, or in possession of illegal drugs.

93You must report to and receive visits from Community Corrections.  You must let a community corrections officer know within two clear working days of changing your address or job.  You must not leave Victoria without first getting permission to do so.  You must obey all lawful instructions and directions from Community Corrections.

94The special or additional conditions are these.  That you perform 350 hours of unpaid work over that period of three years.  That you be under supervision.  That you undergo assessment and treatment including testing for drug abuse or dependency as directed.  That you participate in programs or courses related to offending as directed and under curfew, must remain at 1 Barrel Court Bundoora, between the hours of 10 pm and 5 am for the period of three months, after you leave prison.  You understand that?

95OFFENDER HALL:  Yes, Your Honour.

96HIS HONOUR:  Do you agree to it?

97OFFENDER HALL:  Yes, Your Honour.

98HIS HONOUR:  I'll get both of my staff to go down and get you to sign that. 

99MS HANCOCK:  Your Honour, may I also approach the dock and just make sure my client understands the curfew conditions specifically?

100HIS HONOUR:  Yes.

101MS HANCOCK:  Thank you.

102HIS HONOUR:  Yes.  All right, I'll sign it now.  Now is there anything else I need to do in relation to Mr Hall?

103MR ROONEY:  No, Your Honour.

104HIS HONOUR:  All right, thank you.

105MR ROONEY:  I just have the amended indictment.

106HIS HONOUR:  Yes, that's fine.  If you could just - thank you for doing that.  Mr Hall can be taken into custody now.  Yes, now the judicial monitoring date should be three months from today.  The judicial monitoring date is 22 September.   

107MS HANCOCK:  Your Honour, I've just been reading the order.  I feel obliged to point out to Your Honour that the - Your Honour had said a condition ‑ ‑ ‑

108HIS HONOUR:  I haven't got it yet, so ‑ ‑ ‑

109MS HANCOCK:  All right.  Your Honour had said there be a condition for ‑ ‑ ‑

110HIS HONOUR:  Well wait until I get it I think.

111MS HANCOCK:  All right.

112HIS HONOUR:  Yes, Hall's gone.  What's the problem?

113MS HANCOCK:  The condition for assessment and treatment for mental health and that's not included on the actual order that's been signed.

114HIS HONOUR:  Isn't it?  And that's what I intended.  Yes, that's right.  So we'll do another one.  We'd have to get him - get Hall back.  Thank you, I'm sorry.  All right, we'll do Culmsee and then we'll go - thank you, Ms Hancock.  We'll just finish Culmsee and then do it.  Yes it was.  Would it help you if I gave you the assessment report where I've ticked the conditions?

115ASSOCIATE:  Well I've only got - I can - yes.

116HIS HONOUR:  She doesn't have mental health, he does.

117ASSOCIATE:  She got drunk and offending behaviour.

118HIS HONOUR:  Yes.  There it is there, they're ticked the ones to - now these are two separate ones are they?  She's got to sign both of them.  So Mr Doyle, the additional for Ms Culmsee are the 250 hours of work, supervision, drug assessment and treatment and offending programs.  So that's right isn't it?

119MR DOYLE:  Yes, Your Honour. 

120HIS HONOUR:  Yes.  Now because there are two separate orders and the reason for that is there are two separate indictments and the computer system, which has only been recently introduced and it is a modern one according to the person who sold it to the department,  it is not capable of including two indictments on one document.  I find that remarkable.  I am just making the comment, I am not asking for any comment by you.  Anyway, that is why we are doing it.

121All right, so I will read out one, but ‑ ‑ ‑

122ASSOCIATE:  (Indistinct words).

123HIS HONOUR:  This is Hall is it?  Stand up, I will read it out.  I will just talk loudly.  Now it is a two year community corrections order.  For the reason I explained, there are two orders, but it is the same order, all right?

124OFFENDER CULMSEE:  Yes.

125HIS HONOUR:  Do not be confused by that.  Mr Hall, we just left something off your order, we will fix up in a moment, all right?

126OFFENDER HALL:  Yeah, no worries.

127HIS HONOUR:  All right then.  Now the usual terms are the same ones that I read out before.  That you report within two days.  You do not commit another offence for which you could be imprisoned, that you do not turn up effected by drugs or alcohol or in possession of drugs.  That you report and receive visits.  That you let Community Corrections know within two clear working days of changing address or job.

128That you do not leave Victoria without getting permission to do so and that you obey all lawful instructions.  The additional are that 250 hours of unpaid work over the two years, supervision, assessment and treatment for drug abuse or dependency and offending, relevant offending programs as directed.

129In your case, I am going to require you to come back to court in four months' time to see how you are going.

130OFFENDER CULMSEE:  Yep.

131HIS HONOUR:  If you are not going well, these days, there is no other option outside of a community corrections order but prison.  So there it is, so it is not over.  All right, now do you agree to that?

132OFFENDER CULMSEE:  Yes.

133HIS HONOUR:  All right, well I will get you to sign.  You have to sign both orders because the computer requires it of us.  Now this is her, yes?

134ASSOCIATE:  Correct.

135HIS HONOUR:  All right, now I sign her.  Is this with the additional is it?

136ASSOCIATE:  Yes.

137HIS HONOUR:  I see.  That is his gaol order, yes.  Now the order left out Mr Hall, the requirement that you undergo mental health assessment and treatment as required, all right?  I intended to include that and it was an oversight by me not to include it in the document.  So I will get you to sign it again.

138You understand the obligations you have.  I do not have to repeat them to you do I?

139OFFENDER HALL:  No, Your Honour.

140HIS HONOUR:  All right, well I will get you to sign it and then I will sign it.  Now I sign it?

141ASSOCIATE:  Yes.

142HIS HONOUR:  All right and that is his.  All right, Mr Hall can be taken back into - that is right isn't it?  All right, thank you.  Yes, all right now those orders will be sent to me in chambers and I will sign them.  There is nothing else I need to do?

143MR ROONEY:  No, that's correct, Your Honour.

144HIS HONOUR:  You are sure?

145MR ROONEY:  I won't reflect any more on this case.

146HIS HONOUR:  No.  Just put it - file it away, Mr Rooney.  All right, well thank you for your assistance.  You are excused.  You may go.  Remember it has not gone away.

147OFFENDER CULMSEE:  Yep, thank you.

148HIS HONOUR:  I make an order for six months.  That has not been put in either for six months.

149MR DOYLE:  That's right.

150HIS HONOUR:  Six months disqualification or suspension - disqualification from applying for a licence.  That needs - that does not have to go on the main order.  You can go Ms Hancock. 

151MS HANCOCK:  Thank you, Your Honour.

152HIS HONOUR:  You wait here Ms Culmsee, we need to change the final order.  You might not have done it yet, have you done the gaol order or the court order for Ms Culmsee?

153ASSOCIATE:  It doesn't matter, I can add it.

154HIS HONOUR:  All right.  You are not to apply for a licence for six months from now.

155OFFENDER CULMSEE:  Okay.

156HIS HONOUR:  Good.

157MR DOYLE:  We're free to go, Your Honour?

158HIS HONOUR:  I think so.

159MR DOYLE:  Thank you. 

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