Director of Public Prosecutions v Bagnall
[2025] VCC 433
•7 April 2025
| IN THE COUNTY COURT OF VICTORIA AT MELBOURNE CRIMINAL JURISDICTION | Revised Not Restricted Suitable for Publication |
CR-24-00796
CR-24-00797
| DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC PROSECUTIONS |
| v |
| SETH BAGNALL |
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JUDGE: | HIS HONOUR JUDGE MAIDMENT |
WHERE HELD: | Melbourne |
DATE OF HEARING: | 13 September 2024 & 2 April 2025 |
DATE OF SENTENCE: | 7 April 2025 |
CASE MAY BE CITED AS: | DPP v Bagnall |
MEDIUM NEUTRAL CITATION: | [2025] VCC 433 |
REASONS FOR SENTENCE
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Subject:Plea - sentencing
Catchwords: Sexual penetration of child under 16 - possess child abuse material - persistent contravention of family violence intervention order - assault with weapon – contravene interim personal safety intervention order – commit indictable offence whilst on bail - contravene conduct condition of bail
Legislation Cited:
Cases Cited:
Sentence:4 years' imprisonment, non-parole period 2 years and 5 months
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APPEARANCES: | Counsel | Solicitors |
| For the Director of Public Prosecutions | Ms C. Duckett | Office of Public Prosecutions |
For the Accused | Mr G. Chisholm | Stephen Peterson Lawyers |
HIS HONOUR:
1Seth Bagnall, you have pleaded guilty in relation to Charges 1, 2 and 5 of sexual penetration of a child under the age of 16. The first of those, Charge 1, is a rolled-up charge involving three separate instances of your commission of that offence. The maximum penalty for each of those three offences is imprisonment for 15 years. On Charge 3 on the indictment, you have pleaded guilty to possession of child abuse material, for which the maximum penalty is imprisonment for 10 years. On Charge 4 you have pleaded guilty to an offence of persistently contravening a family violence intervention order, for which the maximum term of imprisonment is five years.
2You have also pleaded guilty to some related summary offences and asked me to take those into account. The first, Summary Charge 11, is an offence of assault with a weapon. The second, Summary Charge 3, is an offence of contravening an interim personal safety intervention order. Both of those offences related to your victim's mother, and the maximum penalty for each is imprisonment for two years. You also pleaded guilty to Summary Charge 4 of committing an indictable offence whilst on bail and Summary Charge 6 of contravening a conduct condition of bail, for each of which the maximum penalty is imprisonment for three months.
3You have a criminal record, although I mention immediately that you have no prior convictions for any sexual offence. That record shows that, for a court appearance at the Sale Magistrates' Court on 26 October 2021 for a number of offences which did involve violence, you received orders from the court without conviction and the matters were adjourned to allow you to continue with treatment at the Latrobe Community Health Service for drug and alcohol counselling.
4The prosecution tendered and relied upon a summary of prosecution opening for plea dated 26 July 2024 which became Exhibit A at the plea hearing. I am not going to read that in great detail, but I need to at least outline in a summary form the facts that were relied upon by the prosecution.
5At the time of the offending you were 21 years of age. You were born on 29 July 2002 and you were living in an apartment in a town in the Latrobe Valley. Your victim in relation to the charges on the indictment is a young lady who at the time of the offending was 14 years of age and lived with her mother at an address in Traralgon.
6The second victim, the subject of related summary offences 11 and 3 to which I have already referred, is her mother.
7In about March 2023, you used the internet to contact your primary victim, the 14-year-old, and invited her to connect with you on Instagram. At that time she was living with her mother in temporary housing accommodation elsewhere in Victoria. After some communication over a period of time through the Instagram platform, you eventually agreed to meet with her in person and you did so at a local railway station. You then began seeing each other more regularly, often at a shopping centre, and an intimate relationship was formed between you.
8You were aware at that time of the age gap between the two of you, you being 21 years of age and she being, when you first contacted her, almost 14. When you engaged in a sexual relationship with her, she was just over the age of 14 years. Indeed, you exchanged messages with her prior to 29 April when you turned 21 in which you discussed your relative ages.
9It became apparent from police investigations of your text messages which were obtained after your phones were seized that you had on 24 April 2023 sent your primary victim several text messages expressing your concern about her mother and others and their attitude towards the relationship between the two of you. In one message you said 'all someone has to do is mention my name to the cops and the age difference and I'll get in some trouble. I'm not worried about me that much, more worried for us'.
10Your primary victim's mother became aware that her daughter was seeing an older male. She expressed concern about her daughter's welfare and told her she wanted to meet you. You initially declined to meet her mother because you were apparently concerned about her attitude towards the age difference between the two of you.
11In May 2023, your primary victim and her mother moved to the address in Traralgon. On the same day, the 14-year-old victim invited you to come and stay the night at her home and you were introduced to her mother. You told her mother that you were in love with her daughter even though you were older, although you claimed that you were aged 19 instead of aged 21 at that particular time.
12After you arrived at the address, you and the 14-year-old went into her bedroom where you had penile vaginal intercourse with her. You did not use a condom. Following that first occasion, you and the 14-year-old regularly engaged penile vaginal sexual intercourse. It usually occurred at your place of residence and the 14-year-old would regularly travel there by bus to spend time with you at your home.
13On another occasion, the 14-year-old wanted to have a shower at your home and suggested that the two of you have a shower together. You had penile vaginal intercourse with her in the shower. Those two specific instances are part of the rolled-up charge, Charge 1, on the indictment.
14During the seven-month relationship, according to the evidence gathered by the prosecution, you and your 14-year-old victim engaged in sexual intercourse almost every day.
15The last occasion upon which you had sexual intercourse with her, and which is dealt with as part of Charge 1 on the indictment, occurred on Monday
6 November 2023. On that occasion, the 14-year-old had travelled to your home town by bus. After arriving at your home, the two of you started kissing and you introduced your penis into her mouth and that is the subject of Charge 2 on the indictment. You then had penile vaginal intercourse with her without a condom, which forms part of Charge 1 on the indictment. After you had engaged in that and finished watching a movie, she caught the late-night bus back to her home in Traralgon.16Other sexual activity occurred between you during your relationship. In the course of the relationship, you and the 14-year-old victim exchanged nude pictures of one another via text messaging and other messaging applications on your respective phones. Some of those communications are relied upon by the prosecution and are set out in detail in the prosecution opening and form the basis of Charge 3 on the indictment of possessing child abuse material.
17The 14-year-old victim's mother suspected that a relationship between you and her daughter involved sexual activity. She confronted her daughter about it. Her daughter denied it. Her mother then discovered text messages on her daughter's phone which suggested that you were attempting to get her pregnant so that you and she could have a child together.
18Concerned about her daughter becoming pregnant and other aspects of the relationship, her mother took steps to try and convince her daughter to end the relationship with you and encouraged her to cease communications with you. When that failed, she went to your home and implored you to stop seeing her daughter because, as she pointed out and you well knew, she was then only 14 years of age. She also told you at that meeting that if you were to continue seeing her daughter, she would report the matter to police. Undeterred, you and the 14-year-old continued to see each other.
19In late October 2023, her mother made a formal complaint to police about the relationship.
20On 9 November 2023, the 14-year-old accepted her mother's advice for her to end the relationship with you. She blocked you on her social media platforms so that you could not then communicate with her.
21On Friday 10 November 2023, you attended your 14-year-old victim and her mother's home in Traralgon. They were inside the home when you arrived. The mother was asleep and woke to loud banging coming from the front door. After she opened the front door, you entered the home. She assumed you had come to collect some of your clothing items and had gone to retrieve them from her daughter's bedroom. She told you that you only had 15 minutes to collect your belongings and then had to leave. She was yelling at you from outside her daughter's bedroom.
22You then picked up two metal poles, one in each hand, and came out of the 14-year-old's bedroom. You held the poles over your head and came towards her mother and yelled at her. Her mother grabbed the poles, wrestled them away from you and you then punched her mother in the left cheek with a closed fist. You then went outside with the 14-year-old, continued to yell profanities and called both the 14-year-old and her mother 'donkeys'.
23The 14-year-old asked you why you had hit her mother and you told her that you were scared her mother was going to hit you with poles so you punched her. Police were called by the mother. You remained outside the front door of the home until police arrived but then decamped when you saw the police.
24Whilst police were at the house talking with the 14-year-old and her mother, you sent the 14-year-old text messages to the effect of inviting her not to say anything or you would go away for 'ages'. You then continued text messaging her, imploring her not to tell police about the sexual nature of your relationship, suggesting that she tell police falsely that the two of you were just mates and that you had never done anything sexual. You then indicated that you would attempt to delete incriminating data on your phone that suggested that the two of you were in a sexual relationship. You encouraged her to do the same.
25At about 1.50 pm on 10 November 2023, police interviewed the 14-year-old at her home and obtained a formal written statement from her mother on
15 November 2023.26At about 5 pm on Friday 10 November 2023, police attended at your home to execute a search warrant. You were not at home, but you answered your phone and agreed to meet police nearby. You were subsequently arrested. Your home was searched, and you were taken to the local police station where you answered 'no comment' to allegations that were put to you concerning the sexual relationship between you and the 14-year-old and the unlawful assault of her mother.
27You provided police with the PIN code for your mobile phone. Police gained access to it and discovered material which is the subject of the possession of child sexual abuse material, Charge 3 on the indictment. At the end of the interview on 10 November 2023, you were charged with a number of offences and bailed to appear at the Latrobe Valley Magistrates' Court. Amongst the conditions of bail were that you not contact witnesses for the prosecution other than the informant and that you comply with all conditions of a family violence intervention order where you were named as the respondent and the 14-year-old was the affected family member.
28On the same day police applied for and obtained an interim personal safety intervention order against you in relation to the 14-year old's mother who had been the subject of the aggravated assault with a weapon that had occurred shortly beforehand. That was served upon you at the police station.
29On 17 November 2023, the Latrobe Valley Magistrates' Court granted an interim family violence intervention order against you in which the 14-year-old was named as the protected person. You were present in court when that order was made following which it was explained to you.
30Just under a month later, on 14 December 2023, you breached the family violence intervention order by sending the 14-year-old a text message from a new phone number, re-establishing communications with her.
31Between 14 December 2023 and 1 January 2024, you breached the order on a number of occasions which are set out in detail in the particulars of Charge 4 on the indictment which charges you with persistent contravention of a family violence intervention order.
32On 28 December 2023, you texted the 14-year-old on seven occasions. She answered a call from you and spoke to you on one occasion, accepting your invitation to come to your home. She travelled by bus. She stayed the night and you had penile vaginal sexual intercourse with her that night. That of course also contravened the condition of bail and also amounted to committing an indictable offence whilst on bail, the subject of related summary offences 4 and 6 to which I have already referred.
33On 1 January 2024, in the early hours of the morning, you sent the 14-year old's mother a message via Facebook Messenger which stated 'Do you want me to die?' to which she refrained from responding. Receiving that message caused the 14-year old's mother emotional distress, as no doubt it was then intended to do.
34It was not the first time you had threatened to kill yourself because in messaging the 14-year-old, the subject of the persistent contravention of the family violence order, on occasions between the dates to which I have referred, you sent numerous text messages, sometimes more than 50 in one day, and during the course of those communications you expressed, among other things, suicidal ideation.
35A further police investigation took place, and you were subsequently charged with the offences the subject of your pleas of guilty.
36There are no victim impact statements. However it may be noted that axiomatically there is likely to have been actual and potential psychological harm so far as each of the victims are concerned, more so to the 14-year-old victim. The offence prohibiting sexual penetration of a child between the ages of 12 and 16 is, amongst others, to reduce the risk of willing participants of that age engaging in that kind of conduct. The onus is on the adult to ensure that the offence is not committed. There is a presumption of harm to the child concerned.
37Turning to matters personal to you, I was provided by your counsel with a detailed and comprehensive outline of plea submissions dated 11 September 2024, along with a very helpful appendix A headed 'Personal history of Mr Seth Bagnall' which draws together much of the information about your background and your history of family abuse and deprivation, your history of drug abuse starting at a young age (no doubt borne from that difficult background history) and the trauma that you undoubtedly suffered during your early childhood development through to adolescence.
38I note that your mother died when you were still young. You had regarded her as an ally. Your father had abandoned you and your siblings and moved interstate when you were still at a young age. You left home, were living rough, couch surfing, missing school, and engaging in the abuse of drugs.
39You were very fortunate to have met at school a young lady whose parents, Mr Peter Keenan and his wife, Nicole Keenan, have now provided letters of support dated 9 July 2024,. It seems that their daughter noticed your plight and took pity on you. Then, after speaking with her parents, you were allowed to come and live with them. It was probably the luckiest day of your life when that occurred.
40Reading the letters from those people, who are present in court today, and then hearing them testify in this court at the plea hearing, coupled with the evidence given by one of the two psychologists who provided reports, a neuropsychologist named Dr Borg, identified the nature of the damage which that unfortunate upbringing had by then caused you when they first met you. It seems to have persisted and supports the proposition that was relied upon heavily by your barrister, Mr Chisholm, that you fall within the principles arising from a case in the High Court of Australia known as the Bugmy principles.
41That case is very well known and it recognised that people who have backgrounds such as yours are likely to have suffered emotional damage during their developmental stages which will probably live with them for the rest of their lives and make it very difficult for them to lead a normal life. Frequently, not inevitably, it leads to people like yourself committing serious criminal offences.
42That you do not have a particularly bad record is almost surprising, but I think the punishment you received in 2021 was appearing in court rather than the orders made by the court. I can only assume that that court was informed of matters of a similar nature and realised the need for leniency at that time. Whether they were too lenient with you or not I do not intend to speculate.
43Despite the kindness offered to you by the Keenans, you did not behave particularly well at times during the period that you were under their tutelage and care. I am not saying that you get a heavier sentence for that. That is I think a symptom of the lack of security you had in your early life, the trauma you experienced and the mental impairments that have been caused as a result of that.
44The history, which included the fact that your mother was a heroin addict and may well have been taking heroin when she was pregnant with you with the possibility of foetal alcohol-type symptoms occurring as a result of that and affecting your developmental history is not proven, but is lurking there in the background as a factor that has possibly contributed to some of your behavioural issues.
45I pay a bit of tribute here to Mr Chisholm for the quality of the presentation of your case, but I also applaud Ms Duckett and the prosecution for the way in which they have approached this matter. Ms Duckett indicated that she had read the material provided by Child Protection which shows that there is considerable evidence that goes back a long way of the abuse that you suffered and the concerns that that raised with Child Protection. On that basis, the prosecution do not contest the proposition that the Bugmy principles arise, not just in a general sense, but in a sense that is relevant to the offending in this particular case.
46Those propositions are also supplemented by the diagnoses which are contained in the report of Ms Carla Lechner dated 1 August 2024 which became Exhibit 2 at the plea hearing. The letter from Mr Peter Keenan became Exhibit 3, the letter from Nicole Keenan became Exhibit 4 and the report of Dr Borg became Exhibit 5. I was also treated to very useful testimony from Dr Borg supplementing the information contained in her report. I do not want to raise your hopes that I am not going to send you to prison - I am, because the offence, as you know, demands it.
47But these facts, in a very, I think, clear way, support the application not just of the Bugmy principles, but the Verdins principles 1 to 5 inclusive. It is not suggested that principle 6, which would rely upon evidence of the significant likelihood of you suffering substantial further psychological harm as a result of your term of imprisonment, applies in this case.
48It was conceded, and I think you stated it to one or more of the psychologists as well, that you are probably in the right place in prison at this time. It has given you an opportunity of getting a grip on your health and wellbeing, given you the opportunity of staying away from drugs, putting on some weight and becoming much healthier both in body and mind.
49I take into account the fact that you did not have a particularly easy ride at some of the gaols you have been in. That is not surprising, particularly when information gets out about the nature of the offending. But you have been for a while at the Hopkins Correctional Centre, receiving a much more specialised response to your circumstances in a prison that is geared to people who have been sentenced or are awaiting sentence for offences of this nature. I bring to light parts of the information provided by Mr and Mrs Keenan. On page 3 of Nicole Keenan's letter she says:
‘If Seth is to learn anything out of this experience it will need to be from professionals that take the time to support him in a way that he needs. Not for him to fall through the cracks again, if this happens, he will be an endless statistic on what trauma and undiagnosed disabilities bring to the table. He is loyal and tries hard to be “normal” but he has little control in the end. If he had of [sic] been diagnosed when he was young, he may have had a different time in his youth. I believe he should have been on a disability pension and when he comes out of goal that is what he should be on. He has tried many times to hold down a job but it never lasts, he has had great opportunities. We supported him in 3 different schools while in our care, but is not good with authority, and eventually things get too hard so he runs. He has tried 2 different apprenticeships, supermarket work, takeaway food work and he just can never hang in there.
‘I know while he has been on remand he has been moved multiple times due to behaviour. He just does not get it, and even though he wants to be good he has this underlying issue that in the end wins out and he plays up.’
50It might not be all that easy for you to listen to that kind of thing, but the fact is that these are people who really care about you and probably know you better than anybody else in the world. I think you hear what they say and it is time, I think now in relative sobriety, to take those sorts of comments to heart and be a better version of yourself than you were during the period of the offending about which I have to consider sentence. I am not here to give you a lecture, Mr Bagnall, but illuminate some of the factors that bear upon the question of sentence.
51The offending is serious. As the prosecution point out in their written submissions on sentence, I am required to pay attention to the standard sentence for the offence of sexual penetration of a child between 12 and 16 which is six years' imprisonment, and that is for one offence. Leave aside the fact that I am sentencing you for three separate offences, one of which is a rolled-up charge involving three instances and that is in circumstances in which there were many other instances of a similar nature which are not the subject specifically of any charge. I do not sentence you for those, but that is the context in which I have to look at the offences for which I do have to sentence you.
52The sentencing regime requires me to sentence you on Charge 5 as a serious sex offender because of your pleas of guilty to Charges 1 and 2. The implications of that are that in addition to looking to the guidepost of the six year standard sentence, I have to treat protection of the community as a primary sentencing consideration and I have to consider first ordering any sentence of imprisonment that I impose to be served cumulatively upon any other sentence of imprisonment. So that would potentially lead to a very substantial term of imprisonment indeed.
53I am not going to do that. It seems to me that looking at all of the material, including the substantial matters in mitigation, some of which I have referred to, that that would bring about an unjust result. The principle of totality requires me to impose a sentence that is much less than would result from the strict application of that principle.
54The prosecution has not sought to persuade me that there should be a disproportionately long sentence for you for those offences. They rightly point out the aggravating features of the offending, including the fact that it was over a period of time. You had plenty of time to consider, reconsider and reconsider again what you were doing and the consequences of that. However, one has to balance that against your background and the strong likelihood that the feelings of attachment that you had to your primary victim, the 14-year-old, were such that it was very difficult for you to resist persisting in what you believed was a comforting and loving relationship. Your capacity to control that impulse had been significantly affected by the factors that I have referred to.
55The mental impairments of complex post-traumatic stress disorder, ADHD and major depressive disorder, as well as your regular use of drugs of dependence, are all to be balanced in the consideration of what ultimately is a just sentence arising from that circumstance. It does you no credit that, having had the warning shot across your bows of being arrested and being the subject of a personal violence order involving your 14-year-old victim's mother and a family violence intervention order in respect of the 14-year-old, you persisted in breaching those orders and, after the police had intervened on 28 December 2023, you carried out the further offence of sexual penetration of a child between 12 and 16 years the subject of Charge 5 on the indictment.
56Tempting though it was, because you 'got back together with' the person you felt you were in love with, you engaged in a very foolish act calculated to further confuse a 14-year-old. It is therefore a quite serious offence of its kind even though there was just that one incident.
57Doing my best to draw all that together, it is necessary for me to consider all those requirements of the Sentencing Act in trying to reach a just sentence. I have been greatly assisted by both counsel in identifying what those elements are in finding a pathway between the need for significant punishment and a measure of leniency that your particular circumstances require. I have not found it very easy I might say. The persistence of your conduct in the face of objections from the mother, your response to the mother, your assault upon the mother with weapons, although it didn't cause injury, does you no credit and requires the court to impose punishment for those actions.
58You have expressed a degree of appropriate remorse. You are now much better aware of the consequences of your actions to your victims and the potential harm and the actual harm, that you would have done. I accept that you are now genuinely remorseful.
59You have got a grip on yourself since you've been in custody, particularly since you've been at Hopkins Correctional Centre, and your prospects of rehabilitation are at least reasonable. The fact that you have shown that different attitude now, a more sober assessment of your own conduct and have embraced the fact that the period in custody you have had of some 15 months has actually been beneficial to you and bodes well for the future I think, and enables me to be a little bit more optimistic about the prospects of you staying out of trouble in the future and particularly of committing similar offences, as being at least reasonable.
60It is necessary for me to assess what is a just punishment, to sentence you on the basis that the sentences that I impose must adequately denounce your conduct publicly, have the capacity to deter others from committing offences of a similar kind, and have the capacity to deter you from committing offences of a similar kind. I have to take into account your still relatively young age: you are a youthful offender and still a person with a good deal of life ahead of you.
61You are very fortunate, and I know you are aware of that, to have Mr and Mrs Keenan in your life. I hope you continue to appreciate that and to accept their support and help. You have to set about repairing some of the damage you have done to a lot of people over the period prior to your incarceration on these matters.
62It is very encouraging that you have found activity within the Correctional Centre involving carpentry. I hope that that leads to apprenticeship and finding a satisfactory job. That will help you enormously once you learn the discipline necessary to hold down a job, to stay out of trouble, to earn money, lead a normal life and build on the fact that you will have been away from drugs for quite some time by the time you have finished your sentence.
63I need also to inject an appropriate degree of mercy in your case, in view of your background.
64Doing the best I can to marry all of the competing sentencing considerations I sentence you as follows.
65On Charge 1, you are convicted and sentenced to imprisonment for three years.
66On Charge 2, you are convicted and sentenced to imprisonment for two years.
67On Charge 3, you are convicted and sentenced to imprisonment for two months.
68On Charge 4, you are convicted and sentenced to imprisonment for one year.
69On Charge 5, you are convicted and sentenced to imprisonment for two years and six months.
70On related summary Charges 11 and 3, for each offence you are convicted and sentenced to imprisonment for three months.
71On related summary offences 4 and 6, you are convicted and sentenced to imprisonment on each for a period of one month.
72The sentence of three years on Charge 1 is the base sentence and I order that five months of the sentence on Charge 4, six months of the sentence on Charge 5 and one month of the sentence on related summary offence 11, that is the aggravated assault upon your primary victim's mother, be served cumulatively upon one another and upon the sentence of three years on Charge 1. That makes a total effective sentence of imprisonment for four years.
73I fix a non-parole period of two years and five months.
74You are sentenced on Charge 5 as a serious sex offender and that is to be recorded in the records of the court. I have indicated already that I do not regard it appropriate to order total cumulation of sentence on Charge 5 because I think it would lead to an unjust result and that the totality principle requires, and justice requires, that I sentence you in the way that I have.
75You will be a registered sex offender for your life. I have already signed the paperwork which gives you details of your obligations under that requirement, and you will be required to report as indicated in that material. In a minute you will be handed that document and asked to sign it as indicating your receipt of the document.
76I order forfeiture in accordance with the draft that I have been provided with and I have already signed that. I take it there is no objection to that, Mr Chisholm.
77MR CHISHOLM: No, none, Your Honour.
78HIS HONOUR: Yes, all right.
79I declare 459 days pre-sentence detention as time to be reckoned as served on the sentence that I have imposed, which will mean, I think, that before you become eligible for parole you will probably have to serve another one year and four months of that, something of that order.
80It may look a long time ahead, but if you can look at it positively, as you have the more recent period of your incarceration, then you can build on what you have already achieved in that time, you will come out a much more skilled carpenter than you are already, with hopefully enough enthusiasm to carry you through to a career in that type of work perhaps, and at least it gives you a good start when you eventually are released.
81From the testimonies of Mr and Mrs Keenan you can hopefully get support from them at that time, whether they are generally in Victoria or generally in Queensland. You can look to them for support and that that will help you in prospect of your release, but after your release also.
82I declare that but for your pleas of guilty, I would have sentenced you to imprisonment for a period of five years and four months with a non-parole period of three years and six months.
83Counsel, are there any further orders that I need to make or any adjustments that I need to make?
84MS DUCKETT: Not from this side of the Bar table, Your Honour, thank you.
85HIS HONOUR: No. Mr Chisholm, anything that you have got?
86MR CHISHOLM: No, Your Honour.
87HIS HONOUR: No. All right. Yes, now Mr Chisholm, would you mind accompanying my associate ‑ ‑ ‑
88MR CHISHOLM: Not at all.
89HIS HONOUR: ‑ ‑ ‑ to ensure that your client is aware of what he is being asked to sign.
90MR CHISHOLM: Your Honour, Mr Bagnall has received that and signed acknowledgment of receipt of the information.
91HIS HONOUR: Yes, thank you. Thank you very much, all right.
92Well I thank both counsel for their very significant assistance in this sentencing exercise, and I particularly thank the Keenans for their attendance today and their show of support.
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